audio research sp-10

Where to start :-). 1st, relax about what jafox said - he was addressing the comment to someone with very high level expectations in an advanced system/setup. That SP10 is a far better pre-amp than many new ones sold today and the phono stage is still world class.

You have good ears...if you can tell the difference between the high and low gain stages. My compliments. The low gain stage should be slighly (!) less transparent, you are putting an attenuator in the signal path of the source (Shanling in this case). ARS is the name of the tube retailer, it is not the name of the manufacturer. You will have to gently pull one of the tubes from its socket - you will then find on the tube the manufacturer's name.

Before you start doing a micro exam of tubes etc, I would suggest that you make sure that your speakers are set up to their best advantage - to do that you must have an understanding of their radiation pattern - some speakers are meant to be pointed straight ahead - to listen to them pointed at your listening position will make them sound very aggressive and bright. Such speakers have a wide radiation pattern and will bounce sound off the wall (ceiling & floors) which you refer to as the 1st reflection points - these points must be deadened or the reflected sound will hit your ears mili seconds after the direct sound from the speaker - this will increase the apparent amplitude of the highs and muddy up the direct signal. Since you are dealing with high frequency signals you can usually deaden this area by using heavy wall hangings, book cases, etc - most anything that absorbs sound. As a temporary test, just hang some heavy wool blankets on the walls adjacent to and slightly ahead of your speakers. Also make sure that you have some type of deadening materiel on the floor (carpet/rugs). I have also had a lot of success in small rooms crossing these types of speakers so that the axis' cross well in front of you, at about the same relative angle to your listening position as they are when pointed straight ahead.

Once you have done that, then I would suggest that you become very logical in your approach to solving your problem. I would start with the CDP (which I suspect may really be the problem). Listen to other sources, the better the quality, the better the test. Listen to the Shanling in some ones else system if your can and see how it compares. If you rule out the Shanling as being a problem then you can go to the next step - FWIW, this pre-amp is not euphonic but it is not(!) inherrently bright. Its like an old Ferrari - its still very capable of very high performance if set up and maintained properly but its not one that you would want to just drive about town and to the grocery store.......Hope this helps and feel free to ask more questions, we all want to help.

Bluefin, FWIW, contrary to your common misconception, the high/low setting switch on the SP10 does NOT attenuate the gain from the line stage as seen by the amp, it reduces the gain from the source(s) as seen by the line stage amp by 12db. In the SP10 the line stage gain remains 26db whether the switch is in its high or low setting. This is not typical of many pre amps which do allow attenuation of the preamp gain itself. And as an aside, personally, I would not want an attenuator between my line stage and my amp, semi purist that I am! :-)

omg i'm such a geek..lol..i searched ARS tubes on google...apparently military tubes?? are they any good? i have sooooooo much to learn..speaking of which..what's the bypass switch for on the sp-10? thanks in advance for your patience :)

The by pass switch is used in conjunction with the phono section - it allows for the phono section to bypass all of the controls on the preamp (except volume) and take the signal straight to the line amp section. By the way, I have not heard of a tube manufacturer known as ARS. FWIW, tubes used in military applications are typically more rugged tubes, but not necessarily better sonically. To further your basic knowledge of tubes, I would suggest that you visit another audio forum, Audio Asylum, go to their FAQ's and read Joe's Tube Lore. Its a great primer.

Newbee, I never made the effort to try other tubes in the SP-10 like you have. This perhaps would have helped a little with the 10's line stage performance, but the RAM tubes worked so well for me in the phono stage. I must have been a lucky customer of RAM tubes.

When I heard the LS5, it was so far ahead of the 10 that simply could not be entirely due to tube rolling. And in fact, when I got the LS5, I still had some RAM tubes which I used later on and they worked very well.

Yes, there were rave reviews on the 10 back in the early to mid 80s. But this was relative to its competition at that time. Keep in mind that all the reviewers at that time were using LPs as their primary source and for the most part, they could not stand the sound of CD playback.

Anyone who claims the 10's line stage (CD) capabilities to be excellent or even very good simply has not heard the incredible products from the last 10 years. But indeed, when used for phono, it has incredibly magical abilities like very few phono stages out there.

I can only imagine what an overhaul of this unit by Great Northern Sound could do to its capability. But the LS5 and PH2 outperformed the 10 in phono and by quite a large margin. By the time you got an 10 on the used market (typically running at around $2200 and who knows why!), and then paid for the upgrades, etc., for an overhauled 10, I feel you could be so better off to go down a number of other paths with newer products. If I sound very critical of the 10, it is only because I feel it was optimized for phono and because products like the LS5, PH2, BAT5i, BAT31SE, BATP10, AesthetixIo, etc., take music presentations to a whole new level that once you hear this, there's no going back to the 10. But for 8 years for me, for LP playback, the 10 had no competition....including the SP-11. For a full unit preamp, the CAT SL might just be the ticket.

And I have to smile and laugh at synthgirl's comment that the LS2 had no magic compared to the SP-10. I absolutely concur! When I sold the 10 I was sure the LS2 (along with the PH2) would be what I had wanted as a major "upgrade". The LS2 was hands down the most disappointing audition I ever had. I guess this was due to my great expectations. But hearing the LS5 minutes later at the same dealer brought back that awesome SP-10 magic but with refinements all over the place. The price scared the heck out of me but once I heard it, I knew I had found what I had been searching for. I just coudl not understand how ARC had products that sounded so very different: the LS2's analytical and sterile presentation and the LS5 with it's SP-10 like bloom and harmonic richness. The fact that Stereophile gave both these units a Class A rating was absolutely ridiculous!

So if you're only looking at CDs as a source, or other line-level sources, I would recommend that you sell the 10. From what these sell for, and if you want to stay with ARC products, you can get an LS5 MK III and you will never look back. Even the MK II in the $1500-1800 price range is a steal.

John