HOLO Audio Spring DAC: Affordable discrete R2R Multibit Dac, could be a winner.

pixelplay

Good review of the sound got with this dac in just 2 paragraphs.
I take it with PCM, 16/44 or 24/96 or DXD?.
Later one doing DSD would be nice as well if you have any?

Cheers George   

I have had my Kitsune level 3 DAC burning in for 3 weeks.

Relaxed,detailed and full come to mind. The most important attribute in my system is TONE and not to the expense of detail.
the Holo spring delivers this in spades with a huge soundstage. The highs have a really nice analog liquid quality which allows the music to be layer out in front of you. Everything is palpable without being forced or fatiguing. Bass is full and enveloping. Dynamics are riveting.

One can say that all described above are traits of R2R which is true when well implemented. I just want to listen to more music as it sounds like music!

I will have a chance to compare it with an MSB diamond which would be interesting and I may have a chance of comparing it to a T&A DAC 8, however this is not confirmed.

I took a punt on this DAC as an early adopter and I held my breath on first listen as you can emagine..... all I can say is that I am very very pleased that I have. Tim at Kitsune has been a pleasure to deal with and I can't reccomend him highly enough.

I have absolutely no involvement with Holo or Kitsune and the DAC was purchased with my own hard earned money.

Hey! it wasn't just me that said it was a poor review, regarding how it sounded. Over on the SNA forums they are saying the same.

Cheers George

 

George, Since you called me a computer geek, I’ll call you a poor reader. :) Why would you say I had no 44k/96/192/DXD (i.e PCM) comments about how it sounds. Nearly all of my examples (Radiohead, Gillian Welch, Keith Richards, Bill Frisell, etc) were redbook or 24 bit PCM examples, played back in NOS mode (i.e same sample rate as music source). I explained the timbre and dynamics of the PCM playback, etc. What did you want?

And I have also stated that I am getting the Yiggy in Wednesday (shipped today from a generous CA member).

The headphone Spring I didn't get a chance to hear, the one in the Linear Tube Audio room with Evoke Eddies sounded very nice replacing an Ayre Codex.

Thanks for your thoughts dragon_vibe, and very true!

After comparing and owning many DACs, I find the playback design stuff to sound one of the best and reasonably priced. Saying that the coding in the R2R and FPGA dacs makes all the difference. Its not just about hardware only.

And, how do they sound at RMAF? TIA!

There are 2 Spring L3s at RMAF.

milpai - I don't believe that is possible unless there is some converter I'm not aware of. PS Audio transports have an I2S output which could connect to the Holo DAC via HDMI for WAV files. Their newest model allows connection via I2S including DSD from SACD discs but only with an approved handshake outputting to their own DirectStream DACs. The Bryston BDA-3 supports DSD decoding from SACDs on universal players via conventional (non-I2S) HDMI connection. Hope this helps!

bimmer100,
Since you are the distributor of Kitsune DACs, have you thought of creating a "circle" on AudioCircle dot com? Once you have a good enough base, folks can use that site for Q&A, FAQs, interacting with other Kitsune products, etc.

bill_k,
Thank You for the information. I was not aware of that. So how would one get the DSD stream from a universal player's "HDMI out" to a DAC like the HOLO via I2S?

pixelplay - Do you have any comments to share about the Holo DAC yet? TIA

Now that would be interesting! 

I’m very interested on this DAC, digital audio is very interesting, because the digital side advances too fast. Of course, the analog side is essential, but is very entertaining to see how digital products evolve.
Price/performance has nothing to do here.

I bought my Metrum Pavane because it sounds vastly better than: DCS Debussy with external clock, Bricasti M1, MSB Analog with power base and Playback Designs MPD-5. Yes, I’ve listened to all of them in my system, and the Metrum is 1/4 the price...why is better? Well, FPGA corrected bespoke R2R ladder chips and fully balanced, dual mono configuration :D

I want to try this Level 3 Holo Spring DAC and a Singxer SU-1 (to use the i2s connection, which is always the best) VS Pavane & Microrendu...maybe is worse than what I have but one never knows! :)

The HDMI input on the Holo Spring DAC is not compatible with a conventional HDMI output like that from a blu-ray or dvd player. It is wired according to the I2S connection standard which is used by PS Audio and some others like the Singer SU-1. Any standard HDMI cable can be used for the I2S connection but the pins for I2S are used differently than the conventional HDMI connection standard.

Read the review by Ted on computeraudiophile.com. Very interesting indeed, especially since it has I2S.
Bimmer,
It a blu-ray player with HDMI out is connected to this DAC with a HDMI cable, will this DAC be able to process the DSD stream via I2S? Or is the I2S completely different than a regular HDMI?
This DAC looks like a competition for Bryston BDA-3, since it also has separate paths for PCM and DSD and the Bryston also has HDMI "in".

I agree

bimmer100

Bimmer, your connected in some way to Holo, get them to give a review sample to Stereophile for a real review and if JA’s lab tests concur with what the reviewer hears, which "can sometimes" keep them honest.

Cheers George

Finally a review, BUT!!!! it’s done by a computer/software geek, with more emphasis on what the source is, and not much in the way of how it sounds, especially nothing when being fed PCM, 16/44/24/96 or DXD pcm, which is where it should shine.

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/722-holo-audio-spring-level-3-kitsune-tuned-edition-r2r-dac-review/

Cheers George

My Holo Audio Spring Version 3 arrived yesterday and is currently warming up and burning in :)

Thanks Charles for the further info, I was not sure if the lineup had changed. Will be interesting though.

Full disclosure,
My Yamamoto DAC is modified with the Duelund CAST copper foil capacitors  (output coupling) SR Black fuse and sits on, a  Star Sound Apprentice platform.
Charles, 

Hello Greg, 
I had mentioned this in an earlier post. My friend has the Bricasti SE and I have the Yamamoto YDA-01a DAC. He uses a MAC computer set up and I use the P.S.Audio PWT.
Charles, 

Charles,
Thanks, Will wait for your report.
Jon.

Hi Charles,
That is some setup that it will be tested in! I look forward to your combined thoughts on the sonic signature of the Holo. What may I ask is it up against?

Kind regards
Greg

Jon,
My friend will audition the Spring DAC in his main system. It will be used with his Absolare Altius preamplifier. If I’m able to hear it in my system it will used with the Coincident Statement Line Stage. Either will most definitely reveal the innate sound character of this DAC.
Charles,

Comments from Jeff Zhu :-

".....I can’t say it’s 1 or 2 DACs inside. Physically, it is 1 DAC module, but it works in 2 different modes. Each mode uses different part of the module and also shared some parts. Spring is a 24bit DAC, bit23 is msb (most significant bit) and bit0 is lsb (least significant bit). Yes, you are right, more bits can be used for digital volume control. But Spring is a pure DAC without digital volume. Actually digital volume is no match for a good resistor attenuator. That’s why we need a dedicated pre-amp, rather than use digital volume in a DAC....."

Because all digital domain volume controls "bit strip" if not used at or above 75% of full volume.
EG: The lower you go the more they strip, 16bit, 14bit, 12bit resolution.
That’s why it’s best to leave them at full and use a 10kohm passive preamp, like the $49 Schiit Sys. If your poweramp is 47kohm input impedance or higher.
http://schiit.com/products/sys

Cheers George

The Spring dac does not come with digital volume control and requires a preamp according to its designer. He must have very good reasons to not include a digital volume control.

Looking good Gary, looks like you upgraded to the silver power transformer and the AES to the Audio Note or did you already have the silver power transformer? It would be interesting to see how it now compares to the Metrum Pavane etc. thanks for providing your feedback as there are very few reviews/comparisons available. That said, I have placed an order for the level 3 version....

yes , i just upgrade today , first impression is not bad, increase in the whole performance but not huge than upgrade the silver transformer, have to wait til it burn in to evaluate, my level 3 full grade with audionote trans 280 in below

http://upload.review33.com/2ndhand/201609/201609052212332600.jpg

Hi Gary, did you get the Jensen capacitor upgrade?

Jon,
The good news for my friend was he had no problem selling the Playback Designs. Audio  products that reach esteemed status via reviews and word of mouth sell quickly in most cases. When I sold my Metrum DAC a few years ago I received five offers within 6 hours of placing my audiogon ad. At that time it was a very hot and high in demand DAC. The Yamamoto flies under the radar in U.S.and wouldn't sell as easily on the used  market despite its excellent sound quality. 
Charles, 

Charles,
You are so right. The Yamamoto punches way above its price point.

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/yamamoto7/dac.html

Rgds. Jon.

Jon2020, 
In theory you’re right regarding price category and expected performance. However actually listening to components in your system proves otherwise. I’ve learned that price/performance isn’t a linear relationship. The friend I referred to earlier had the highly touted Playback Designs unit(16 K at the time) in his system several years ago. The truth? It was clearly outperformed by the far less costly Mod wright modified Oppo 2 chassis player! This was with both CD and SACD.

Generally speaking you get what you pay for, in High End audio there are definitely exceptions to this mantra, no question. This has taught me that you must listen to audio products when ever possible. Speculation and expectations can be wrong. This applies to cables as well in my experience.
Charles,

The Yamamoto YDA-01 dac at $2450 would be a better comparison with the Spring dac than the Bricasti SE at about 4 times the price of these 2 products.

Hello Bill,
The primary comparison will be between the Spring DAC  and Bricasti SE. The Yamamoto is definitely a lesser known Japanese boutique product. It has been built by a very talented designer and sounds superbly natural and is musically/emotionally engaging. This comparison would be optional. 
Charles, 

Charles,
It would be extremely helpful to hear how both of those comparisons go, especially against the Bricasti SE since that's a more widely known product. I look forward to your further thoughts on the Holo DAC.
Enjoy the tunes!
- Bill

Bill,
Yes I was referring to current to voltage conversion (I/V). It is usually via a resistor (passive), Op amp or sometimes a transformer (Audio Note). However as Al wrote R2R ladder circuits can have voltage output rather than current output. I’m just curious how this interesting DAC achieves its output.

A good friend of mine decided to order this DAC (level 3 version ) and should have it in a few weeks. He has a Bricasti SE which sounds terrific in his system. I think that this is going to be a interesting comparison. If possible I’d like to hear it in my system and compare to my Yamamoto YDA DAC. It’d be fun to hear this DAC in two very differently assembled audio systems. Well common ground is we both have "class A amplifiers". I have  8 watt 300b SET mono blocks and he has 600 watt Krell FPB mono blocks 😁.
Charles,

Regarding I/V conversion, I have no specific knowledge of the HOLO DAC’s design beyond what has been posted and linked to here, but it seems to me to be possible that it doesn’t need any. A ladder-type D/A converter circuit, including "segmented" ladder types such as the HOLO appears to be, can be designed to provide either a voltage output or a current output from the ladder itself.

Of course in either case an analog output stage of some sort would most likely still be required. Although if I recall correctly one of the very expensive upper echelon TotalDAC designs manages to do without even that, and by using a multitude of D/A converter circuits in parallel can apparently provide adequately low impedance for many applications without having any active devices between the ladder and its output.

Regards,
-- Al

I haven't seen anything specified regarding the type of I/V conversion circuitry used in the Holo Spring DAC, if that's what Charles is asking about.

The player is aurender n100s , in between n100s and spring , there is a bryston buc-1 usb converter , i am using AES in , 

Gary,
What is the I/V  conversion method?

Hello gary9413 ,
You have assembled a very nice and well thought out system.  I believe choosing the Spring DAC level 3(upgrade capacitors and transformer)  was a good decision.  I sincerely believe that opting for the highest quality transformer/caps offered  are the type of choices that make a true difference in sound quality. Your system  IMO will be capable of resolving the improvement these better parts provide. I'm confident that you'll have no regrets. I like the fact that the transformer is a robust 100 VA. Most DACS use the smaller 15-30 MA size.
Charles, 

Getting a bit confusing here, "discrete dsd" vs. native dsd........

From Jeff Zhu, the dac designer :-

"If Spring works in ’NOS’ mode. There is no oversampling, no conversion, just the original data doing the final digital to analog conversion..........I just explain how Spring can do ’discrete DSD conversion’. Actually it is like DCS and CHORD. If you looking to DCS and CHORD’s pcb, you will find ’discrete DSD conversion’ is also using
switches and precision resistors, like resistor ladder dacs. So, no matter it is ’discrete DSD conversion’ or ’discrete PCM conversion’, they all use the same discrete devices. Just work in different architecture. That makes possible to combine these two modes in one device."

as i know , AK4137 is only for SRC, it is bypass in the nos mode

nos mode should be optimal for pcm as I have found with my own Esoteric dac(N-05 which uses the AK 4490 chip) set at no upsampling plus pcm filters off.

Looks like for dsd, the Spring dac needs to be switched out of nos mode to OS(oversampling) or OS DSD mode as stated in the CA forum thread. This is similar to the Esoteric dac.

Ah I know which you are talking about, thanks for the info.
Im very interested on your thoughts beyond your earlier comments on its sound as there is just so little information on this dac. Have you got the Jensens installed?

Thanks again for your time and thoughts.

My hong kong dealer tell me that, most digital device , there is a digital isolation transformer locate before the digital in/out ( aes, bnc, coaxial), many company use very cheap one $ few cents, and i upgrade it to us$170 audionote pure silver transformer, but it is only benefit in these 3 digital in , useless if u use usb or i2s, the transformer pic in blow

http://upload.review33.com/2ndhand/201609/201609021240305730.jpg