3 things make a great speaker cabinet,drivers and crossover these together make a great speaker.
How do you know what a good speaker is?
Frequency response for high end speakers at every price level is usually relatively flat. The differences in audible sound quality reported by audiophiles is disproportionate to the differences in frequency response between different speakers therefore frequency response cannot be a very significant factor in what we're hearing.
Distortion is usually below 0.5% so again the same reasoning applies.
I'm not convinced that polar response is quite as important as is sometimes claimed.
If you look at the specs of most ultra high end loudspeakers, there's no hard evidence provided by the manufacturers to justify their claims that their speaker is vastly superior.
And if there was it would need to be independently verified.
So how does the consumer know how close any given loudspeaker is to the ideal loudspeaker? How do we know how close a loudspeaker is to recreating the sound of a violin, cello, piano, human voice, or anything else?
What makes a magico vastly different from a yg or Wilson? On the other hand if the difference between these speakers is extremely small then why is there such a discrepancy in opinions and why do we need a yg and a magico and Wilson and tidal audio and b&w etc on the market if they're all so similar?
Distortion is usually below 0.5% so again the same reasoning applies.
I'm not convinced that polar response is quite as important as is sometimes claimed.
If you look at the specs of most ultra high end loudspeakers, there's no hard evidence provided by the manufacturers to justify their claims that their speaker is vastly superior.
And if there was it would need to be independently verified.
So how does the consumer know how close any given loudspeaker is to the ideal loudspeaker? How do we know how close a loudspeaker is to recreating the sound of a violin, cello, piano, human voice, or anything else?
What makes a magico vastly different from a yg or Wilson? On the other hand if the difference between these speakers is extremely small then why is there such a discrepancy in opinions and why do we need a yg and a magico and Wilson and tidal audio and b&w etc on the market if they're all so similar?
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A great speaker will be sought after as a reference for many decades and remain in production for many decades. A great speaker will be equally sought after by professional audio engineers, studios, musicians as well as audiophiles. The toughest test for a speaker design is to remain desirable many years after the initial product is released without any significant changes to the design/sound. The easiest way to sell speakers is like B&W - aesthetics and new models coming out each year or so and with every model sounding/looking different - just like a shoe store or fashion clothing store - lots of choice! Without resorting to a time-tested design, a buyer might stumble on the latest best thing since sliced bread speaker but in all probably a buyer is simply looking at a speaker that just happens to be the fashion du jour. |
@kenjit - one more important speaker attribute - i.e. LOOKS ! "Generally" - this has little to do with the sound produced, but if a design pleases the eye of the listener then it can play a significant role in a listener’s final choice. e.g. Speakers with those bright cast aluminum chassis or those spectacular Horn speakers, tend to look more expensive and will probably win out over a more mundane design regardless of performance But back to the questions in your original post...how can one judge speaker performance? It comes down to very subtle differences in what the listener is able to discern. Basically, how well suited is that specific speaker suited to the listeners ears. Everybody’s ears are very different and therefore, we each hear different subtleties from one speaker to another. The tools for measuring speaker performance are not capable of "rating" the tonal qualities of a speaker AND take into account the acuteness of each individual’s hearing. It would be nice if one day, someone invents a Timbre Meter :-) Technological Advances in driver design can give a brand a perceived "edge" - i.e. some listeners can discern differences while others just like the idea, or must have the latest in technology. e.g. the Plasma Tweeter Driver - supposed to provide excellent reproduction in the very top end, but my ears could not discern it’s advantages over a more conventional design, so for me it was not worth that additional expense - but they did sound very good :-) Unfortunately most of the results from today’s wonderful developments in speaker design are lost or coloured in the inadequate listening environments of our local audio stores and homes and the systems & cables they are connected too. e.g. - my speakers were designed and tested with the aid of an anechoic chamber at an independent institute using the most sensitive tools to "gauge" performance. Results from SPL meters, oscilloscopes etc.. show the speaker replicate the input signal to a high level of accuracy. But that was far from the listening environment at the store where I bought them and totally different from my house/room where I listen. And then MY ears provided that final judgement. How do I asses speakers? - personally, I have been exposed to the playing of "live" instruments for most of my years and have become very familiar with those sounds. That is what I use as my reference. If a speaker can reproduce those sounds to a degree of accuracy as I recall them and to what I deem as an acceptable degree of accuracy, then it will probably be the one I select I no longer look at spec’s, because as you stated … - they are ALL so very similar. I Trust my ears - they are the best tool each individual has and they can save you a ton of cash. Why pay for something you cannot hear? FYI: - I always take my amp and cables to audition speakers - Trusting my ears has lead me to buy only two pairs of speakers in nearly 35 years for my audio system. - My speakers are mundane to look at - but they sound great Unfortunately - there is no real answer here, but maybe some insights? Happy Listening - Steve |
The polar response is indeed important, but the off-axis measurements done by Stereophile, SoundStage/NRC, etc. use is more telling. Good vertical response is important too, say withhin a +/-10° window; this is where speakers like the Tekton Double Impacts do horribly in, you need to be on the reference axis or else the response changes greatly. Dynamic compression is also important, how the speaker measures at low and high volumes. How its spectral decay and transient response is also are important. You want fast transient and an even decay that’s also decently fast. |
The reason why the majority of speakers offered today have good frequency, dynamic, timbre and spacial responses is due to competition from a wide variety of designers and companies, each with their own version of the answer to your main question. Each individual carries her/his own set of subjective, objective, emotional, quantitative and qualitiative values, opinions, ears and eyes as to what forms the so-called "ideal." Even identical twins have their own sets of preferences simply because it's physically impossible for any two people to always occupy the same place and time, and experience the exact same things, simultaneously. I celebrate that we get to live in a time when there is an abundance of choice, that there is no "ideal" or absolute, and that part of the pleasure is in the hunt to find the speaker, and, as importantly, its associated components and listening environment, to form the system, and, as Tom says, puts the smile on my face and makes me want to listen for hours. |
I think my speakers are good. They are largish tower speakers. They pass Tomcarr's smile test every time. And are a joy to listen to all evening long. I don't know enough to explain why they are 'good'. But the two things you notice most when you examine them is that they are dense. Knock on them with your hand and it feels like they are made of a solid block of wood. Seriously. And the second thing you will notice is that they are heavy. Even heavier than their density and appearance would suggest. So heavy they are difficult to move around and re-position with just one person. I have no idea if these are critical speaker features or not. But they are definitely noticeable and apparently very intentional. |
Frequency response for high end speakers at every price level is usually relatively flat. The differences in audible sound quality reported by audiophiles is disproportionate to the differences in frequency response between different speakers therefore frequency response cannot be a very significant factor in what we’re hearing. I completely disagree. If you are going by specmanship, yes, this is true. You cannot look at a speaker’s numbers. However, I have found repeatedly that the details of the FR matter a great deal. A lot of speakers which are purported to give details, or incredible imaging have tweaks in the FR and if you know what to look for you’ll see it. The tell is a reviewer making a claim like this: I found myself going through my old record collection and I heard things I've never heard before! That's usually a pretty good indicator of this. It disturbs me greatly when I see audio critics calling these speakers transparent or neutral when their own measurements show otherwise. JA does this to the pint when he finds a neutral speaker he calls it deliberately altered. The point is, these critics set the bar as to what the community calls neutral. Besides FR and distortion, dispersion and stored energy matter a great deal. Dispersion affects how well a speaker will sound in a particular room and where imaging will be best. Stored energy will affect the ability of a speaker to sound natural, transparent. Another overlooked item which matters (more with some amps than others) is the impedance curve, and I know for a fact some manufacturers deliberately tweak their speakers to be more "discerning" of amplifiers. I reiterate my position: Buy what yo like to listen to. You have that unqualified right. These are my technical observations. E |
I can't count how many speakers I've heard that sounded good, but you were hearing the sound of the speaker and not the sound of the music. I decided I wanted to hear the music and not the speaker; that's why mine are custom made (absolutely not recommended). A speaker design engineer assisted; he designed the crossover, and I chose the drivers. The cabinet was the hardest part, which is why I would never do it again. Imagine crystal clear electronics, and you got my speakers; by not having a sound of their own, it makes them different from any speaker I have ever heard; they only reveal the sound of the music. The bottom line is; do you want to hear the music or the speaker? The speaker you choose is the best speaker for you. |
Distortion is below 0.5%? In what universe?! On some speakers at some frequencies at some SPL, but nothing more. All speakers produce huge amounts of distortion at even 40Hz (10% is common), let alone 30 or 20. And while above bass and midbass frequencies the percentage is less, it is nowhere near as low as 0.5 at realistic SPL. You don’t need specs or verification of them to hear the serious colorations in loudspeakers. Buy or borrow a recorder of some sort, a microphone or two, and make recordings of family or friends speaking. Play the recordings on your speakers to hear how much they change the sound of even voices! Do the same with an acoustic guitar, drumset, or piano. The most interesting thing you will learn is how much better (more lifelike) a homemade recording can sound in comparison with a commercial one (LP, CD, etc.). |
I don't see how measuring a speaker against what a live guitar or live piano sounds like is practical. Even in a live situation a mic'd acoustic guitar will sound different from an un-mic'd guitar. If we're hearing it on a speaker then that sound has been recorded by someone. And all the manipulation that involves. A recording is not the real thing. So it seems to me the gold standard would have to be that what you are hearing is being heard the way the engineer/producer intended you to hear it. |
@n80, did you ever read how Doug Sax (the legendary mastering engineer, producer of the Sheffield Labs LPs) evaluated both equipment and his recordings? Going into the studio, listening to the live sound, then going back into the monitor room and comparing the sound coming out of his (horn) loudspeakers to the live sound, making adjustments as needed to minimize the difference between the two. For equipment evaluation, he would do a by-pass test. Who knows how "the engineer/producer intended you to hear it"? They’ll be the first to tell you what he heard in the studio and what he captured on tape are miles apart. Having spent a fair amount of time in studios, I guarantee you most commercial recordings are NOT made to sound "accurate", but rather "good". To evaluate, say, loudspeakers using a recording you have no way of knowing the actual sound of is one of the major paradoxes facing the consumer. |
Folks who like live modern rock music should take an SPL meter next time you go to a concert in a smaller venue and see how loud it gets. To recreate a similar experience on home audio equipment will require a system that can handle unrealistic SPL levels without either blowing speaker drivers - mostly due to inadequate power, or sound extremely compressed. Other genres are different with exception of certain western classical content and some instruments within that content and during short transients. So the notion of comparing live music with home recreation of that same musical experience is not always a good baseline for evaluation. |
@bdp24 Agree completely. I probably should not have said how the engineer/producer "intended" it to sound. As you say, I think there are many legendary engineers who do have a very specific intent but even they don’t know when, where or how we will be listening to the music. I suspect most of the rest of the producers/engineers out there are just getting product out the door and/or dealing with budget and time limitations. "I guarantee you most commercial recordings are NOT made to sound "accurate", but rather "good". Agreed. That’s why I don’t think looking for accuracy is the best way to evaluate a speaker. There are usually too many variables and too much variance in production. I guess is all you listened to was classical piano and you knew which producers tried hardest for accuracy then that might be something to seek after but that would be a very narrow measure of a speaker intended for broader use. And maybe what makes a good speaker should be defined as a speaker one likes. But I will say this, the more I listen and the more I think about SQ the more I realize that for me it comes down to two big things. And oddly, sound stage isn’t one of them. The first is what I’d call separation or distinction between instruments, voices, etc and the second is sharp, tight, distinct, well defined bass. And then it comes to what I don’t like and that is overly bright high frequencies. Maybe fourth comes soundstage and as long as it isn’t one dimensional I’m happy with that. |
Studio monitors rarely make good pleasure listening speakers, and if they do, they're probably not very good monitors. How long a speaker is made doesn't have much to do with anything either. Bose made 901s for eons and those sound like garbage. And what about the ESS AMT1? Those things came out in 1975 and they're still making them. Is that thing better that the many iterations of the Wilson W/P? As for reproducing the live sound at home, you're doing it all wrong if you're going to your local HiFi shop. You should be going to Thunder Audio and buying some Milo cabs and a couple of 650HP subs. No consumer speaker comes close to creating the SPL that a Meyer rig does. |
It’s easier for me than many others, as my main criteria when evaluating a speaker is of it’s ability to make singing voices and acoustic instruments sound as timbrally-lifelike and coloration-free as possible. Non-Classical acoustic music is performed at modest SPL, so extreme capability in that regard is not necessary (though nice to have when I have a cravin’ for AC/DC ;-). The bottom note of a standard 4-string bass (both electric and acoustic upright) is located at 41-42Hz, so the 20-40Hz octave is not an absolute requirement. But an 88-key piano extends considerably below 40Hz, a pipe organ (heard in much of the J.S. Bach I love) down to 16Hz! Bass is expensive, but we no longer need rely on loudspeakers to provide that; there are some great music subs available now. |
Kenjit, I would say that correct phasing and driver coherence is just as important as FR. By driver coherence I mean that the sound is the same from both drivers at the crossover frequency. Better yet is no crossover. Some new ESL’s are like that, like new Quads. How do you know? You'll have to listen. |
As an old, very old, user of Acoustic Research speakers; esp the AR-3A, I believed in their testing of the quality of sound from a speaker. It was how near a live performance could be had. They would put a string quartet behind curtains in a outdoor setting and asked people if they could tell the difference between a live performance and a playback on their speakers. A good speaker should be neutral and add nothing to the original sound. After more than 45 years and thousands upon thousands of dollars spent.....I have not reached the mountain top. Close and yet still wishing. |
By listening with your ears! Measurements (most of them) are worthless. I need to know how efficient the speaker is so I know if I’m going to need a different amp or if my existing setup will work. If I like a pair of speakers that are 65db efficient, I will need a larger more powerful amp. As for most measurements in audio, when have you seen measurements for the new car you are buying? You might want to know mpg and if it will tow a trailer. The manufacturer might state the car has 300hp, but does the new owner really know if the engine measures 250 hp or 310hp? We don’t, and we don’t care. On the test drive, if the car responds to my right and left feet and my 2 arms on the steering wheel, I’m good to go. I don’t need to know if the hp is lower than specified, or cylinder leakage is out of range or what the vacuum pressure is? why would we care if distortion of 1 amp is .006% and the other amp has . 00.005% distortion. Like we can hear that. |
Lots of stuff here. From some of the comments I read above my post my two cents is that the speaker only passes the information that is sent to it. For example what "you" may think is the best speaker might not sound as good in every system as stated above. But to me a speaker will sound good if you components can deliver the goods first. So how do you know what a good speaker is, I knows it when I hears it! Happy Listening. |
Only the few lucky, well experienced music lovers (audiophiles), with good ears and enormous amount of listening hours to different hi-fi equipment (well over 100 of good to excellent systems) at the luxury of their homes are the one who can be objective in evaluating equipment. You cannot objectively evaluate any equipment, by listening for a few hours here and there - whether in your friend house, the local store or at the music show. And, please stop saying that we hear differently, and that everyone has different music sound preferences. If this was the case, how come we agree when it comes to quality LP’s or Mater tape recordings with superior sound? How come we agree what sound’s great when it comes to the best music halls around the world? Am I crazy or the rest of you are? |
First off no one can audition all speakers.. My take on how to start? Word of mouth, audio sites. What speakers do folks who are audiophiles a long time use? What models are year in year out great and well liked? One is way more likely to (even accidentally) end up with a GREAT set of speakers that way. |
The sound must be as pure,like the (good,professional) recordings. There are a lot of bat recording and that is sad, because you pay for a good cd,or lp. Every speaker is different ,but the most important thing is that you have a good harmony between high-mid and low. The most of the speakers (and amps ) have too deep low, throughout wich the “mid” is supplanted. A Nice explane of a good speaker is the Ilumnia Magister.: a driver with a “floating” conus. In a while, he will be available in the States and Canada. I never heard such a natural speaker before. |
Doug Sax at the Mastering Lab used Tannoy SRM-B 10” monitors in the early years with his own ML crossover. In later years, he used ATC 150ASL monitors similar to Pink Floyd and Telarc. At one time he was so busy that he was mastering 20% of the top 100 billboard albums. His work always sounded great. The secret sauce was the tube preamp designed by his brother, combined with great ears and great monitors. Large ATC are rated at 120 dB SPL continuous at less than 0.3% THD. Of course at lower SPL the distortion is less. If you listen to ATC then on countless classic albums you will be hearing close to how Doug Sax heard it when the mastering was done (room, source, preamp excepted). There is a selected list of albums on wiki. He did 1000’s of albums. Go to guy for all the top studios. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Sax Doug’s original reference was live sound, as bdp24 indicated. He pioneered direct to disc. However he became so popular that eventually he had a busy business simply doing the final mastering of everyone’s mixes - hence the Mastering Lab. He was revered by legendary engineers with golden ears - a king of kings. You can’t expect to have ears like Doug Sax. He is probably unique in the history of audio engineering. However, the ATC’s he used were out of the box unmodified and you can buy them as they are still in production. I believe that Manley issued a commercial production of a clone of Doug’s Tannoys but with heavier cabinets - the Tannoy ML10 - you can find these used (the driver is no longer in production). You can be confident that these are both good speakers, as the greatest ears of all time depended on them. https://www.manley.com/pro/manls/ |
"How do you know what a good speaker is?" There's probably not too many speaker designers out there that think their speakers are bad. The important thing to understand is, when you are bringing their speaker into your home your also committing yourself to someone else's paradigm. A speaker is a tool, nothing more and nothing less. If a speaker fulfills your goal it's a good day. MG |
+1 n80 On the sold and heavy cabinets, mine are 80kg (176lb) ea. And they are not so good looking, but provide countless hours of joy. And I understand some isolation from the (stout) stands (or floor) is critical, currently using asorbathane of the firmer type (70 duro). I imagne good speakers can be found in lots of places, but great ones are a treasure, and often worth their weight - pardon the pun. |
When I hear the violin on a good recording of Erbarme Dich on my Graham Audio LS 5/9 as I did this morning before going to work, know I have the speakers for life, they might not have the deepest bass or the most detailed highs, but the music they make sounds so realistic and true that the shortcomings are totally forgotten, also to be able to listen for hours on end without any fatigue is such a nice pleasure, if a manufacturer gets the human voices and instruments right, then some shortcomings in bass or treble it is possible to live with, but for me get the midrange wrong! Then I can not listen long to that speaker, also getting older it is not so easy to hear the highest notes;-) so for me a rolled of treble is no disappointment. |
@rbstehno Its funny how different we all are. I study car specs very closely. They actually tell you an awful lot if you are using the vehicle to its maximum potential. Not saying everyone should, but if you do then the specs are critical and you have to know how to evaluate them. I have high expectations for my traveling car (comfort, handling, hp/torque curve, etc. My truck has to pull 9000 pounds strongly and safely and my track car has to keep me safe and keep up with the Miatas (which can be harder than you might imagine.) My analogy probably does not carry over to speakers, just saying that in some areas specs can be important. |
inna4,896 posts12-18-2018 2:59am Wrong. This is an awkward effort to please the crowd and renounce objectivity. Really good speakers will be acknowledged as such by everyone with hearing regardless of sound preferences.No speaker system is perfect. That means weighing the strengths and weaknesses of each is a personal, subjective opinion. There can be no universal consensus and to argue that there is, or should be, is simplistic or naive. |
N80 - We are different but probably more in common than we would think. My point was that MOST people will put down $50k to hundreds of thousands of dollars on a car and they don't know much about the true specs of the car. Sure they know that it has XXHP, XXmpg, size, and they base their decision on seat of the pants test drive or from past experience. I've owned Porsche's and even then I didn't ask the Porsche dealer for a cylinder leakage test or dyno results before buying the car. For a track car, if I had a guy build me a 1 off engine that was supposed to get 600hp, then yes, I would demand proof of that. But since we buy production line audio equipment and cars, we tend not to have to go into that deep into specs |
Please, stop saying that " we don't here the same and we have different tastes in sound quality" If this is the case, how come we agreed on the best sounding music halls around the world? How come we agreed on the best sounding recordings from LP, Master tapes and even CD's? I think the core statement is provable. With age, gender and individual exposure we all have measurably different hearing. On top of that, we have very different choices in music, and listening habits and our pleasure centers are trained by our past. Listening at low volumes vs. concert levels is a very different thing, and we are right to want to judge our speakers based on that alone, not to mention music preferences. Oh, and then there are rooms, and amplifiers. Both of these can make a significant difference in the sound. So, the truth is we do not here [sic] the same and we do have very different tastes in the experiences we wish to have. Best, E |
Great question. The short answer is I don't. One thing I can say is that after attending jazz concerts in a small venue, I was left shaking my head when reflecting on my present system. It has to be incredibly difficult to capture and render in an accurate fashion the level of dynamics and speed of transients I kept hearing. Stat's and horns come the closest but even then it's a tough act. I realize this is a theoretical goal which will never be reached but my question is are we even close? I'm skeptical. |
I have 2 dissimilar speakers around, Silverline Preludes and Klipsch Heresy IIIs, and they sound astonishingly similar relative to general tonality. Although the Silverlines are reasonably efficient, my quest for more efficient speakers led me to try Sonist Recital IIIs which are beautifully made and efficient, but not for me tonally as I was used to the Preludes clearer top end...sold 'em...Next I auditioned the Heresy IIIs and thought...hmmm...could be the thing...bought a pair and man...these things are really great sounding speakers, coherent, efficient, accurate, engaging, short, fat, etc., need subs which I have, so now I'll say goodbye to the Preludes. Note that all of this was prompted by switching to a lower powered single ended tube amp that sounds glorious, but sounds gloriouser with efficient speakers, and the Heresy IIIs provide that efficiency. System dependent? You bet. |
The truth is this, and it has been pointed out before, and above. We are not hearing " just the speakers ". We are hearing the system, which besides the speakers ( and there specific set up ), includes the room acoustics, the listening seat, the associated equipment, and who knows how much tampering and manipulation of the actual recordings themselves. Now, do you want to talk about over the ear / closed ear headphones ? Let us face it, the speaker is very dependent on everything else. So the question should be " when do you know when a system sounds good to you ? That, to me is simple. When you want to continue listening, to this recording, and to that recording, and to another recording, and so on, and so on, and so on....Enjoy ! MrD. |
Yep you only know a good speaker for sure when you hear it and each speaker has to be setup properly (including a proper amp) to enable that. Speaker A might handily sound good and Speaker B not on Amp A but swap in amp B and the reverse is very possible. Also it is true that if the speaker is an easy load to drive, chances are it will sound good off a wider variety of amps than otherwise. A good example is KEF ls50. State of the art within its limits in many ways, but will not sound good if amp is not up to the task of driving them ie lots of clean not just power but also current. I’ve heard both cases in my house. Compare to Fritz Carrera, designed to provide a very easy load to drive. . I heard these sound very good indeed off a 7 watt headphone amp recently and have no doubt they would excel with most any amp used. |
Regardless of price, every speaker will be a compromise in one way or another. Basically it sounds perfect to the designer given the constraints (price, resources, materials, drivers, components,etc). what it it comes down to fir me is can I live with those compromises and do I “feel” the music? If I get goosebumps listening to certain tracks then I know they are good for me. |
@audiojan I have met a few speaker designers in my time, typically during the introduction of a new " ready to sell " set off speakers. This has occurred in retail outlets, hotel rooms, shows, my home, as well as others. The fact is, every designer I have met, never had the " my design is perfect " attitude. That " attitude " was handled by a hired marketing rep or sales agent ( I did that for 2 companies for a short time ). Not that my conversations with any of them were very long, but it was always as if what was going through the designers mind was I could have / should have done this. None of them were " happy " about the design, probably because their minds were thinking of the next improvement or upgrade. My take from experience. ( BTW, same for any designer I have met. The sales and marketing reps, they were the promoters. Enjoy ! MrD. |
@mrdecibel I think we agree. :-) Hence the comment "given the constraints". I've found most designers I have spoke to are reasonably happy with their design (and yes, they are all thinking about what they could've done differently and how they are going to improve them). The point I was trying to make that a "good speaker" is highly subjective and in reality doesn't exist. It's only "good enough" |
n80 wrote: I don't see how measuring a speaker against what a live guitar or live piano sounds like is practical. Even in a live situation a mic'd acoustic guitar will sound different from an un-mic'd guitar. Agreed there are problems involved in comparing live to reproduced sound. Yet I have to say I've found such comparisons quite useful and enlightening. I've been obsessed with live vs reproduced sound as long as I can remember. So when I became more fervent about trying many different speakers and systems, in the field but especially in my own home, I made decent quality recordings of familiar acoustic sounds - my wife's voice, sons, my acoustic guitar, my sons playing their school instruments - trombone, sax, etc. Being extremely familiar with those sounds, they really illuminate how closely a speaker in question can reproduce them. And sometimes I would do direct live vs reproduced comparisons (typically with speakers in my home). Lots of speakers fail the comparisons, but some are surprising. My Thiel 3.7 speakers, for instance, reproduced the sound of my playing my acoustic guitar with fairly astonishing accuracy - timbre accuracy, clarity, etc. My MBL 121 omnis can reproduce the sound of my son playing sax with amazing verisimilitude. But I don't always need those recordings on hand. When I go to audio shows, or high end stores listening to systems, it's often the case there are real voices nearby (obviously at audio shows, and often at a high end store the salesman may be talking to me or chatting with someone else). So I often stop and take stock: if I'm playing, say, a good recording of Johnny Cash or some other simply mic'd male voice, I close my eyes and listen to the real voices present in the room and compare it to the reproduced voice. What IS IT that the real voices have that distinguish them from the voice coming through a sound system? It's always very telling, and the systems that actually have the least obvious departure from the real voices are the ones that I inevitably find the most mesmerizing and satisfying for long listening sessions. (Naturally the more complex and demanding the music source may be, the less able a modest system will be able to keep up. But, in general, a system that captures certain essences of live sound, to my ears, tends to predict longer satisfaction FOR ME). |
The "live vs. recorded" thing always mystifies me...is a driving simulator like actually driving? I own high end acoustic guitars, there's an acoustic piano in my hifi listening room, I've been a professional musician for 50 years, I mix live acoustic and electric concerts, and otherwise I'm simply wonderful, although that part is debatable. I KNOW recorded music sounds different from my guitar in my lap, but don't care one iota as I can enjoy the stuffing out of recordings anyway, as long as the performance is great and the producer and engineer aren't idiots. I've been to classical concerts where you could barely hear much of the music (Brad Mehldau playing unamplified piano in a hall that eats sound, the BSO hall burying it's orchestra in reverberant mush), and have heard other acoustic and miked stuff that was astonishing...including a recent Vijay Iyer duet with Dr. Lewis Porter...2 unmiked pianos...astonishing. If you want your last Metallica concert reproduced in your apartment you deserve the eviction notice your landlord is working on, otherwise just remember you're not actually driving. |
