Jazz for aficionados

Acman, no one can get to where these special people are without practicing; no more than a professional tennis player can get to where he is without "practicing"; but, after a "special" musician gets to be a professional musician, when he's performing, he's also "practicing".

Hard Bop jazz musicians are in no way similar to "concert" musicians; they do not play the same thing time after time; their minds are as active as their fingers, searching for something new and different.

Did you see the intensity of concentration on Art Peppers face when he was with the rhythm section? Got to be right on time, not a split second early or late.


Enjoy the music.

This (and the dope issue) has been touched upon ad nauseum here; unfortunately I don’t believe that there has been substantive actual discussion. On the issue of "practicing": for starters, there simply isn’t enough commonality in commentators’ understanding of what "practicing" actually is for any discussion to be significant. It would be nice if there were more openness to a point of view based on facts; instead there is staunch adherence to certain misconceptions based on the romance of the tortured artistic savant. Re drug use: while it is undeniable that some jazz musicians, like every other segment of the population, will be driven to drug use because of personal problems, it is a well documented fact that many started using simply because they wanted to emulate everything that their musical heroes (Bird) did; including, and sadly, drug use. Given all this, I think it’s probably best if the topics are dropped. Just one man’s opinion.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PL08wkpFF-0UWOIRiIj0OiUdM30HlnvzVM&v=Jq7H2E4q83c

Coincidentally, I listened to this great record today. First the important stuff: the subject of drummers has been discussed recently. Jack DeJohnette is a genius and one of the most innovative and influential drummers in jazz. As an aside, while I may have been a bit tough on Ginger Baker, my comments were based on my sense that the sophistication in his playing is nowhere near that of a Jack DeJohnette. Keith Jarrett, the leader of the date, is a rather polarizing figure in jazz. I think the issue is that he has a very unique sense of what the rhythmic feeling of jazz is "supposed" to be for some. I love his playing; after I make the adjustment to that other rhythmic sensibility which is not "swingy" in the usual way. Fantastic ensemble playing with tremendous synergy. Why coincidence? The not so important stuff:

Listen at the end of this great performance of "Stella". At 7:34 we hear Jarrett say "I hope they taped that". Why is he hoping? Aren’t they there to record? Yes, but that was not supposed to be a take; they were rehearsing/practicing. It is not uncommon for recording engineers to have the tape rolling during rehearsals and sound checks so as not to miss a potentially great performance. This was a perfomance of a standard tune with no unusual arrangement. Imagine if Jarrett had brought a brand new composition that the other players were seeing (on the printed page) for the first time. They practice.  (Oops, I guess I didn't drop it 😉)

Frogman, that was kind of sneaky the way you discussed both drug use and practicing, while suggesting we not discuss the subject any more.

I'm thankful that although we don't see drug use among jazz musicians, it is a serious problem in this country from North to South, and East to West. From time to time, we have wandered off the subject of music, and I have no objections to that.

Back to the subject of music, and special musicians; I had to laugh when "Bird" emphasized the aspect of schooling, like he had been to Juilliard School of Music. Of course schooling is important, but special people like him have done quite well without it, because they loved music and had the desire, drive, and ambition to succeed, even though school was unavailable due to economic reality.

In small "hard bop" jazz groups, spontaneity is the element that makes them sound so fresh. What they played depended on what was played just before their solo. Herbie Hancock told of the time he "goofed" and played wrong notes, but Miles came right behind him and made it come out beautiful.

In music, what ever the situation calls for, is the thing to do.



Enjoy the music.

Miles said the only thing that made a note right or wrong was the note played after it.

O-10, c'mon now, there was nothing "sneaky" about it; I think I was pretty direct about it.  It is the gross over-simplification of these topics that I think makes it pointless to discuss; that, and, as I said, the staunch adherence to certain misconceptions.  To use Bird as an example of these "special musicians" (which he of course was) and then dismiss Bird's own assertions about the relevance of "schooling" strikes me as highly ironic.  Beyond that, I don't disagree with your comments "back to the subject of music", I just don't understand what any of that has to do with your initial comment about practicing/rehearsing, your initial comment; it doesn't. This is what, for me, makes it pretty pointless to discuss; hence my comment.  Personally, I would prefer to comment on the Jarrett clip, the great drumming, or the "fly on the wall" moment that I pointed out.