VPI Classic vs. Well Tempered Amadeus

Vortex,
Thank you for a thorough comparison of the two tables. Perhaps you'd be willing to come back to the thread after you've spent a considerable amount of time with the WTA and do more comparisons focused on the sound. You know, after the novelty factor wears off...:) As I mentioned in my thread above, I had an opportunity to listen to the WTA in a very good set-up and it definitely did not have a better bass or detail than my Classic. Of course the sound is so system- and associated gear-dependent, on top of any evaluation being a very subjective affair to begin with. Nonetheless, I'm rather reluctant to believe that the WTA is better in such a profound way right out of the box, after just a few hours of listening. Was your Zephyr set up correctly on the Classic? Sounds like you had some issues with aligning it properly. I can't help but think that the crazy tracking error on the WTA makes Mr. Baerwald, Loefgren, and the rest turn in their graves. Is it possible that it's fast food packaged as high-end in terms of sound? Or is it genuinely a high-end product that renders the established understanding of analog equipment set-up obsolete or irrelevant?

Now as a suggestion, if you're keeping the Classic, look into replacing the stock feet with brass footers, such as Bearpaws. Not only will they improve the sound, but will also eliminate the marks if you need to adjust the table.

Also, the Counter-Intuitive is great indeed, but I'd recommend O-rings for an even easier VTF and Azimuth adjustments in addition. This would be especially helpful for the WTA from what you described. An O-ring will provide not only a point of reference, but also prevent any unwanted movement of the counterweight, especially if you have shaky hands.

that's interesting, because the bass is such an improvement over what I had. it's so smooth and natural sounding, very very nice. I'll be the first one to admit if something is crap, even if I spent thousands of dollars on it. there's no novelty to the WTA, it just sounds amazing. I think my cart on the VPI was setup to near perfection using a 10x magnifier and a MINT Tractor, but it was not easy for me. it sure was much much better than using the stock alignment tool from VPI.

to be honest, I was kind of hoping the VPI would sound better and I would keep that. I'm going to lose money by selling the VPI and I just think it is a much better looking table, without the quirkiness too. it was pretty obvious though that the WTA is better sound wise in every regard, in my opinion and in my system.

"Nonetheless, I'm rather reluctant to believe that the WTA is better in such a profound way right out of the box, after just a few hours of listening"

Actusreus

Believe it. This table is the real deal.

Shakey

I have been anxiously awaiting Vortex's update after setting up the WTA. So glad to hear the results so far. It's not the drugs afterall. It's the fact that Firebaugh has looked hard at the system of LP playback and re-addressed it with innovative out of the box thinking and design. If it takes a golf ball to do this efficiently, then who are we to argue. Don't have an Amadeus (yet) but I immediately heard the results of his vision the first time I set up my aged Well Tempered "Super". Something squeeky clean and liquid about the sound generated by his zero play platter bearing and floating fluid coupled arm. One of the most important things we want in a turntable is to lose the sense that the music is coming from anything rotating around. You should look over at the table and feel dumbfounded that such a life like illusion can be eminating from it. The Well Tempered products have always had this quality in spades. I certainly understand all the skepticism- no other product I recall has received such unanimous accolades. Particularly, even listeners who have been around the Analog block a few times seem to go GaGa over this thing. Good for you guys. You didn't go the easy route. You didn't just buy another safe bet Corvette. You had the balls to search out a Lotus.

Believe it. This table is the real deal.

I'm sorry, I don't. I heard it and it did not impress me. Perhaps if I hear it again, I'll retract my opinion. I'd have no problem doing so.

Btw, lack of a lift mechanism alone would prevent me from buying this table. It is not so much lowering the stylus onto the record as it is lifting the stylus off the record that would give me a life-threatening anxiety. A small, uncoordinated move and you could send the the cartridge to its demise. No, thank you.