An Amplifier Change for my Wilson Sophia 2's?


I have an Audio Research VT100 Mk II with 100 watts of tube power driving my newly acquired Wilson Sophia 2 speakers.  The sound is lovely, and the specs seem to be fine, but I do have to crank the preamp pretty high to get relatively loud music, especially when playing analog.  It got me to thinking that maybe these speakers would be better served by a lot more power.  

If I were to make a move here, I would be looking for a price neutral move.  That means selling (or trading) my amp for its market value (about $2300) and purchasing something at the same price.  

My initial research pointed to Bryston power amps, either an older one from the family of 4B Setreo amps or 7B mono blocks.  Either would deliver more than 500 watts into 4 ohms.

Would this much power make a large difference in the performance of the Wilsons?
marktomaras
Well, Al,
If you and few other poster were speaking about where 100W per channel can bring Wilson Sophia, it’s not truly the case and I’ll explain why.
That ARC VT100 would be able to supply to my guesstimate only a third or a quarter of specified power which is only 25...30W realistically at highest volume setting. Although tube amps soft-clip, there’s still not enough CURRENT to move drivers and therefore actual power halves or even quarters. ARC line preamps in general have 20dB of gain so combined 80dB of gain is substantially enough -- no need to move gain higher to 73dB.
Mentioned earlier Bryston 3B-st or 3b-sst/sst2 amps can do much better job but still not enough.
As I’ve mentioned before 250W Electrocompaniet amp wasn’t enough either. It was loud enough, but no 3d and imaging.
400+Wpc/8Ohm and 600+WPC/4Ohm is about right ’prescription’ otherwise money wasted.
There’s one Sunfire Sig 600 for sale here on audiogon and I wish to stretch my budget and get it. I was foolish not to get it at more than half of price years ago, but trust me It’s the best amp ever made for any budget.

Increasing from 100 watts to 400 watts would give another 6 db of volume. Doubling the watts equals a 3 db volume increase. A volume increase of 10 db would sound twice as loud twice as loud.
In other words the starting point isn't 100 watts. Try going from 30watts: 60, 120, 240, 480 ... 12dB -- Now these figures bring you much closer to reality.
Czarivey,

what at do you think about bryston 4bst or a pair of 7bst monos?  They are in the same price category of my vt100.  
That ARC VT100 would be able to supply to my guesstimate only a third or a quarter of specified power which is only 25...30W realistically at highest volume setting.
I would respectfully but completely disagree with this, Czarivey.

First, most tube amps providing 4 and 8 ohm output taps have the same or similar power ratings when a 4 ohm load is connected to the 4 ohm tap as when an 8 ohm load is connected to the 8 ohm tap. As you realize, a 4 ohm load requires more current but less voltage compared to delivery of the same amount of power into an 8 ohm load. And that difference is accommodated by the different output transformer winding ratios that are used for the two output taps.

In this case the amp is rated at 100 watts, and the measurements provided in Stereophile Volume 20 No. 3 for the original (non-MkII version) of the VT100 confirmed that that rating is essentially accurate for BOTH load impedances, when the corresponding output tap is used. (Aside, that is, for a very slight shortfall of well under 1 db that he measured in one channel, which was suspected to be due to a weak tube).

Furthermore, JA’s measurements of the impedance magnitude and phase angle of an earlier version of the Sophia speaker (linked to below) indicate impedance characteristics that are particularly benign relative to those of many and probably most other speakers that are rated as having nominal impedances of 4 ohms.

www.stereophile.com/content/wilson-audio-specialties-sophia-loudspeaker-measurements

Regards,
-- Al


I've known lots about price categories, but quit worrying about that long time ago.
Sunfire sig 600 was the amp able to make WS speakers literally disappear and bring REAL stage.
If you compare depreciation of 7bst vs. sig 600(both were actually manufactured at nearly same time), 7bst lost near 70% of value getting close to the end of bullet-proof Bryston warranty and sig 600 haven't lost a penny and sold often for higher dollar now than it was new.
That should tell quite something I dare to believe. 
There's no doubt to the quality of that amp despite being one of the first class D amps in high-end audio and if I had $30k+ speakers, I would be more than confident hooking them up to this unit.

Al,

The signal response measurements are done at 1kHz. Therefore for some particular reason called 'X', OP asks the question 'Y' for some same reason everything is perhaps 10...12db hungry of SPL and there's one analogy answer that speaks for itself:

If you have glass of water and you try to fill-up the jar, you will need much more than one glass of water.


The signal response measurements are done at 1kHz.
Most ARC amps have lower effective output impedances than the majority of tube amps, and the VT100 is no exception to that. Specifically, it has a specified damping factor of 11, which for the 4 ohm tap corresponds to an output impedance of approximately 4/11 = 0.36 ohms. Per JA’s measurements the minimum impedance at any frequency of the earlier version of the Sophia is 3.26 ohms, with a near-zero phase angle (i.e., an impedance that is almost purely resistive) at that frequency. And at nearly all other frequencies the impedance is significantly higher.

As you’ll probably realize, the result of the interaction of that kind of amplifier output impedance with those speaker impedance characteristics will be not much different than would occur with a solid-state amplifier, namely very little variation of output voltage as a function of frequency. And yes, in a narrow range of frequencies in the area of about 40 to 50 Hz, where the speaker’s impedance rises to around 14 ohms (assuming the speaker’s impedance characteristics are similar to those of the earlier version of the Sophia), and also in the upper treble region where the impedance also rises significantly, the amplifier’s power capability will therefore probably be significantly less than at 1 kHz. As a result of limitations that presumably would occur in output voltage, however, not as a result of limitations in output current as you had stated.

However in the rest of the deep bass region, as well as in the mid-bass and mid-range regions, which encompasses the regions where most music contains most of its energy, the 1 kHz power capability measurements can be expected to be essentially applicable.

Regards,
-- Al