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Another "help me pick speakers" thread

(sorry long post)
Yes, I know these threads are all over the place, but here’s what I’m looking for…
Looking for a small footprint (12 X 8 would pretty much be the max) floorstander, which costs up to $2K used. I much prefer used, because I hate breaking-in speakers, plus, they are generally easier to sell. My amp is a Rogue Audio Tempest 2 (Integrated tube 90 wpc, both 8ohm & 4ohm)- I love it, and have no intention of selling it. I was using Tyler Acoustics monitors and subs (then, a single sub when I moved to a smaller apt), and I just didn’t have the floor space for the sub and anywhere to put monitors. However, I really liked the sound- no complaints (had I not moved, I would have kept that setup). So, now I have the OHM Microwalsh SE (the SE model supposedly goes an octave lower than the older “Tall” model). They are broken-in, and sound great, except the bass. I’m missing the bass-drum kick and the snare-drum thump with these. A sub might help, but I have nowhere to put one (plus, I’m trying to simplify things). I listen to rock- only (and I’m 95% vinyl)… stuff like early Sabbath (the first 4 albums). A few problems… my apt has little room to maneuver speakers- they will have to be very close to the side walls (I sit on the back wall, about 2 feet behind the speakers, and about 5 or 6 feet from each). The WAF is not an issue- she doesn’t care what they look or sound like- but the size IS an issue. When I said 12 X 8 would be the max footprint… I will have to turn them sideways against the wall when I’m not using them- so we can walk by (yeah, I live in NYC). Smaller would be better, but I do need them to move some air. I’ve only ruled out B&W’s (never heard a pair I liked) and Gallo Ref 3 (don’t think my amp could drive them, plus, I don’t want to buy a sub amp- I just sold mine). As for those who say “go demo some and let your ears decide”… I only think in-store demos are good for 1 thing, and that’s comparing one speaker to another. It’s rare to find a store that has 2 different models that I’m even considering. In Living Stereo probably has the coolest employees in the NYC hi-fi shops… most others are clueless, or just trying to make a sale (like, they don’t even ask what amp you are using!) So, here’s what I am considering, please feel free to add to the list (this is compiled purely from reading- I have not heard any of these):

Proac Studio 140 (probably my first choice)
Joseph Audio RM25si
Totem Hawk (worried about placement near wall)
Totem Forest (again, placement)
Rega R5 (might be a little too big, plus not many used ones show up)
Zu Druid (never heard this type of speaker… this one’s a wild card choice)
Quad 22L2 (these are so cheap, it makes me wonder)
ron325
ron325 OP
35 posts
 
My Tylers arrived today... I played the Ohms to be able to make a pretty fair comparison, and then I plugged in the Linbrooks. Wow, what a difference. Mainly in the low-end... this is exactly what I felt like I was missing with the Ohms. When I played Achilles Last Stand (vinyl), I knew within 1 minute I was keeping them. I wouldn't say they sound like I'm using a sub (admittedly, I always over-used my subs), but I feel like I don't need a sub now. Actually, I was pretty impressed with my amp- I didn't know it could pound out the bass.
What I will give to the Ohms is soundstage. Not that the Tylers are lacking, but the Ohms are pretty unreal. But, every time I played them, I felt like I was missing too much bass (and, I was).
I find that I can play the Tylers louder, and they are a little less bright than the Ohms. To my ears, the Tylers do the highs just right (but, maybe because I had Tyler monitors for a few years, and was used-to and liked those).
FYI, for those that thought my amp couldn't drive the Ohms... I can't turn the volume knob much past noon with either speaker, and the actual volume is pretty similar. It's just that the Tylers are much more tangible, because there are some things that small drivers just can't do, which bigger drivers can.
Granted, the Tylers cost more, and they are a little bigger (and about 3 times heavier!), so it's not a completely fair comparison. But, the bottom line is, I need a sub to make the Ohms usable, and I don't need a sub with the Tylers (my neighbors are gonna hate these). Going sub-less was one of my main criteria for this project. In the future, who knows? But, for now (in this particular apartment), I think I'm good with these Tyler Linbrook 2's,
mapman's avatar
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mapman
15,679 posts
 
Ron,

The area where the less than optimal tube amp matching with the OHMs would likely evidence itself be in the bass levels and perhaps also correspondingly unnatural brightness, the things you describe. That could be part of what you are hearing.

Obtainable volume is not the issue, rather the ability of a tube amp to drive the OHMs evenly at all frequencies due to variable impedance at different frequencies.

Nonetheless, I would not expect the tiny MWTs to deliver sub like bass levels in most setups, though a high current high power SS amp would probably have the best chance of getting there.

Glad the Tyler's are sounding good! My only advice would be to not base any listening decision solely on first impressions if you have the option not too.
ron325 OP
35 posts
 
Mapman-
I guess that makes sense about the ability to drive the speakers, although I always figured, if the speakers were not efficient, I'd just have to turn the volume up (and, as I got close to "11", it might get distorted).
I haven't had much experience with very inefficient speakers, nor have I owned a real low-power amp.

"not base any listening decision solely on first impressions"
I was wondering if you meant, because the speakers wouldn't be broken-in (although, both of my sets are used). Or, if you were referring to how your brain expects to hear songs a certain way, and hearing something "different" might be mistaken for "better" (although, I guess it could also be considered "worse", but if you are shopping for speakers, you probably weren't totally satisfied to start).
The Ohms weren't overly bright; it's just that after listening for an hour or two, they seemed, well, I'm guessing that's what people refer to as "fatiguing". However, I think if I added a sub, I could live with the Ohms for a few years and be happy. I just didn't want a sub this time around. The bass slam from the Tylers is impossible to ignore, and that factor alone has me wanting to listen to tons of albums I haven't played in a while. I'm actually hoping for bad weather this weekend, and I never say that.
mapman's avatar
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mapman
15,679 posts
 
"I was wondering if you meant, because the speakers wouldn't be broken-in (although, both of my sets are used). Or, if you were referring to how your brain expects to hear songs a certain way, and hearing something "different" might be mistaken for "better" (although, I guess it could also be considered "worse", but if you are shopping for speakers, you probably weren't totally satisfied to start)."

Mostly the later but possibly both assuming Tylers are subject to changing with break-in (I do not know if they are or not), but ususally speakers only get better with break in, not worse.
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