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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
dgarretson
2,394 posts
 
To the matter of proportion I can only say I have heard Karik & Karik/Numerik-- these are very long-in-the-tooth by today's standards. Even by Linn's definition the Adikt is an entry-level MM cartridge and Kiarn & Klout are middle-of-the-road. The system would not look out of balance were Duelunds not AAA+++ both in price & performance. You're hearing large differences between crossover caps, but the question remains whether even greater and perhaps more cost-effective improvements could be made elsewhere in the chain-- in turn reveal more tellingly the characteristics of those crossover caps. As to Salvatore's website-- always interesting-- but as occasionally explored over on AA, there may be conflicts of interest.

Anyway, enjoy the experiment. I'm jealous as hell that I don't have a fist-full of Duelunds to play with.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
I can not argue much with you at all on the Karik. Like I said myself I did not think it really that good at all. It was so far below my LP12 and I did not have the funds to pursue two top end front ends. Yes the Adikt is entry level cartridge but Linn's advice is Keel/Akito (much cheaper arm than mine)/Adikt. Linn says this betters no Keel Ekos MKII Akiva. So following their line get the table up to snuff then arm then cartridge.

The Kairn is a 2003 or 04 one of the last made. So the Kairn to be much bettered would be the Klimax and that would be a big jump. The Klout is very highly regarded (amongst Linnies) and was the flagship amp until Klimax came out and still holds up quite well today.

As for the Duelund's being rated AAA++ and better than everything else I have, I can not argue there either. But it makes the crossover a area I do not have to go back to and upgrade later because it has become a weakness.

One thing that I do feel comfortable with is I do love the speakers as I have had them for almost 30 years and with this I hope to get another 20 years out of them. So 50 years out of the same speakers is not bad? I have friends who have went through tons of speakers.

Thanks Dgarretson
Make it on your list of things to do is to try even just one cap in your crossover (tweeter) and tell me if you can go back? There was a guy long ago on this thread said (to me) you at least owe it to yourself to at least hear a Duelund. Now I am singing the same tune.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Dgarretson, Do you know anyone who has tried there IC's?

I am NOT getting them as I will be tapped out for awhile but just curious.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?cablintr&1222474219
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Just spent a hour upstairs with the Linn system. My kids who play in the basement have being singing along with the Klipsch for awhile now. My wife who was downstairs was singing as well. (Beatles CD burn in) That is a first for her!

Today when upstairs the kids said Dad can you turn that off!!?? That sounds terrible! My youngest will sit and listen to music a long time for a young kid. I asked her which stereo she liked better and she just looked at me with a stupid look and pointed her thumb down. (meaning downstairs)(they have no idea of my preferences)

I feel when upstairs I can hear someone in the background saying attention Walmart shoppers. (over the Linn system)

So Dgarretson to qualify
I would take a NAD cd player (worth about $20) the Fisher x100d (which is the same as a Fisher 500c without the tuner I think paid $300) and 30 year old Klipsch Lascala's with the Duelund's (and I do not even have the mid caps) hands down with out a doubt over the Linn system.

The Linn speakers sound hard, with crazy amounts of white noise!

My Linn dealer who says when they loan out or sell equipment (not just Linn but whoever) the customer will often say I can tell it's much better than I had. They say give it a couple of weeks and then put the old piece back in. The customer always is "shocked" when the old piece goes back in.

By this I mean getting Duelund's was a massive upgrade. The real "shocker" is when you go back to what you had. (I can go upstairs different system and just shift to the other speaker as well to hear all original)
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Friend stopped by and had a listen.

He owns a set of Klipsch Heresy I's and plays guitar as well. (but not big into audio)

First 10 minutes he liked the vintage caps. He liked the "fuller sound". It was a sound he was used to. He has heard these speakers for more than 25 years. At first he did not know what to make of the changes. He kept saying you can pick out every instrument. (new caps)

After 30 minutes and getting acustomed he said you can pick out the whole orchestra. He said classical music lovers would go nuts. (but was still in the vintage camp for rock)

After about an hour he just kept shaking his head and saying I can not believe caps can do that! I just can not believe it!

He said making the motion of wrapping a peice of paper in to a ball and throwing it. (that is what the vintage sound like just krinkle it all up and through like garbage.

He is more excited than I am about the mid cap. He figures he will pick up everything from his guitar favourites.

He said vintage caps instruments never sounded like the actual instrument. At first he did like the pleasing tones of the vintage caps and that sound was always there even if you had no idea what is was coming from.

He also said if that was just the tweeter caps the speakers would be unrecognisable from original once the midcaps went in.
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