Dedicated phono-pre for MM only?

Hi Axel . . . well, the first question is understanding as much as possible all of the different factors that change between your comparisons with/without the SUT. I'm speculating that some of them are:

-Cartridge loading is slightly different, i.e. more inductive with the transformer
-SUT presents a different source impedance to the phono stage than the cartridge directly
-Phono stage loading switches/plugs/resistors/caps are different
-Phono stage gain is different, likely affecting noise, bandwidth, and distorion
-Of course, the SUT itself has a sonic/performance signature

And some of the likely causes of what you observe:

- more dynamic depth (better hi/low SPL differentiation)

I think this usually corresponds to better headroom, and lower noise floor. The SUT will most likely gives a better En/In match to the cartridge, and better RFI rejection. The phono stage may also have more headroom at the lower gain.

- more powerful bass

Cartridge loading differences, possibly a little bit of low-frequency 3rd-harmonic distortion from the transformer

- more hall/room information, stage depth

I associate this with more high-frequency extension, or different high-frequency phase response. Cartridge loading differences, the transformer's sonic signiture, or better phono-stage performance at the lower gain

Anyway hope this helps a bit, without re-opening the whole SUT/non-SUT debate.

Hi Kirkus,
thank you.
??? >>> ...without re-opening the whole SUT/non-SUT debate. <<<

Not aware of that debate. Is there a thread I can look up you'd recall?

At least as far as MMs are concerned: THERE IS NOT DEBATE ABOUT SUTs :-)
Axel

Kirkus,
since I was rather too curious, I did some back-tracking on the subject in some related A'gon threads. What I come up with is, for best sound for the $$$:

1) 'affordable' phono-stage with MM
2) good stage with MM
3) good stage with SUT and MC
4) top stage with MC

2) and 3) mybe on par, and MC = LO MC > 0.4mV

Raul has his take on what comprises a 'good' stage (3160)and 0.01dB deviation in RIAA --------- other then the one he uses, I've never as yet seen one measured that could do this.
So I can at best call my own lot 'affordable'. ML claims +/- 1dB deviation, my previous GCPH claimed 0.25dB deviation.
Interestingly, the ML sounds better, and maybe due to using the 326S power supply.

Also some other acclaimed stages do rather poorly in this particular measurement.

More food for thought?
A.

I noticed earlier that someone recommended Juicy Music. They are very very good, but unfortunately Mark has retired but will still service all of his equipment.

Hi, Raul, I was wondering about the design of the 3160: What level of gain is bult into the LOMC side of the preamp? It seems that 60 dB or so is the typical level of gain for many (most?) LOMC stages and I was curious what you use in the 3160. Thank you for your time.

Tom