Direct drive vs belt vs rim vs idler arm


Is one TT type inherently better than another? I see the rim drive VPI praised in the forum as well as the old idler arm. I've only experienced a direct drive Denon and a belt driven VPI Classic.
rockyboy
Richard is dead on with his post, in my opinion. Our ears are critical for good reason, so let's go back and take a look at the thread as its originator intended. It is about the three different drive categories, assuming the string isn't in one all its own.

Direct drive:

How well it works depends upon how its speed is controlled and how it is coupled to the platter. Of course, there are many other variables, but these are most critical for this drive method. I believe a great direct drive is the most difficult to achieve because of audible artifacts introduced by most implementations, but some have accomplished the task beautifully. The Mitchell Cotter turntable comes to mind instantly, but others, like Brinkman have done an admirable job. Still, my ears hear a lack of dynamics and a "jitter" with 90% of the direct drives out there. One thing I have noticed about them is that the plinth isn't quite as important as it is in other designs. That's probably due to how the spindle is coupled with the rest of the system. It is a system that can be stellar, but it is difficult to do.

Belt drive:

As we all know, these run from horrid to fantastic. It seems that most are copies of another one, in that they typically use essentially the same motors and same belt treatment, more or less. Others, however, employ ingenious workarounds to avoid any pitfalls introduced by belt creep. The SG Spiral Groove comes to mind with how the motor is oriented to the platter. There is very little spare belt hanging out there in air with that turntable. That differentiates it from the pack, and the results show it. That's only one example, but I gave it to illustrate that there are designers who build belt drives who think outside the box in extremely practical and creative ways. There are others, but most go down the path of the status quo. Anyway, I believe we will see a lot more done with belt drives because there are a lot of ideas that haven't been tried, yet. There are also ideas that have been tried, but forgotten for some reason. Possibly the finest belt drive I have ever heard is the Fairchild Studio 750. This old beast went against convention by using an incredibly high torque motor. Maybe someone will repeat that with a modern incarnation. Even if they don't, great belt drives exist in fairly large numbers.

Idler drive:

I realize that idlers are foreign in many circles, and that biases exist which are based upon vintage units that display what appear to be inherent weaknesses. Most of those weaknesses, however, are due to resonating linkage, clunky top plates, noisy idler wheels, etc. One thing to bear in mind is that the idler wheel tracks with greater inherent accuracy than a belt. The trick is to make it track quietly, which can be done. If one eliminates the noise of the vintage units by totally rethinking how the technology should be applied, an idler can be a wonderful turntable.

So...

Any of the three can be at the top of the food chain. It all depends upon how the design is approached and how practical ideas are implemented that improve on what was done before. We will never settle the discussion of which is best, as long as people fail to realize that drive methods are nothing more than points of departure, and that the devil is in the details, regardless of the method chosen.

I submit to you all that turntables exist, or can be made, of all three methods that are high performers, and that those turntables can satisfy anyone's personal preferences when the problems facing each drive discipline are addressed properly.

.
In_shore -
The centre disc method you outlined is flawed. It assumes the record is round, which often is not true. Therefore the diameters are not consistant. The groove is what is round, not the edge of the record.
The file method I suggested in the speed accuracy thread was trialled by Tonywinsc.
11-26-11: Tonywinsc
I filed the hole in my stereo test record. I improved the runout a bit. According to the iPhone app, I now have the raw Wow down to +/-0.16%. The filtered didn't change, -0.01%/+0.02%. The total spread within the published specs for my tt. With a little more filing of the center hole and more work/patient effort to center the record on the platter, I could improve the raw values even more.
Richardkrebs
Re Your post on the 24/1
I have alluded to another problem with speed stability in DD TTs that is unrelated to stylus drag or cogging...
It occurs at much higher frequencies...
Taking it away however is dramatic.
It also shows that we can perceive timing problems well below the threshold of measuring instruments.

Thanks for your illuminating post. The jitter you are referring to is one of the fundamental shortcomings of the Technics SP10 that other manufacturers have taken pains to design out. It is all too obvious for those of us with a quality turntable that the Technics possesses jitter that would make its purchase unacceptable. I am all too aware of the Technics jitter because my Final simply does not have it. Your attempts to remove the jitter from the Technics is laudable.
Thespier and Thuchan, I agree: posts should not be reviewed for censorship. Let the members have a free conversation.
Richard,

Great post about the arrival time difference between our ears of a sound 15 degrees away from straight ahead. It really made me think about how sensitive our ears and brains are. I'm kind of surprised that I never thought about this. I wonder if this has something to do with components that soundstage and image very well. It could just be that the component processes or amplifies (whatever the component is doing whether it be an DAC or an amplifier) all frequencies and gets them to the output terminals in exactly the same amount of time. The component would also have to have the same exact, non-wavering processing time for the right and left channels.

I checked the math (twice) and got a time difference of 0.00008 seconds between the left and right ears, though, not 0.0000053 seconds as you calculated. I may have made the same error twice or maybe not. It still doesn't change the fact that the time difference is extremely small for a sound that is 15 degrees away from straight ahead.

For those who didn't do the math, at a distance of 4 meters, 15 degrees is equal to the sound source being about 1 meter away from straight ahead. 1 meter is a reasonable distance to use for this calculation. I think anyone could tell if something is straight ahead or 1 meter to the right with their eyes closed. We are probably capable of hearing even smaller changes in distance.