Rich; organic true balanced amp w good detail $6k

Sutts has not mentioned (unless I overlooked it) if his source is fully differentially balanced, so the point may be moot.

I use a fully balanced source (turntable) and an unbalanced source (CD player), which pass their signals through a fully balanced preamp. Both sources sound excellent, or not so excellent, depending on the recording. I do know that those who have heard the Belles amps in their single ended stereo versions and in their balanced monoblock versions universally report that they are more resolving and produce a larger image when run as balanced monoblocks. This would seem to be in keeping with a lower noise floor inherent with balanced operation.

I wonder if the discussion about balanced versus fully differentially balanced is more rhetorical than practical? For the purposes of this discussion as it relates to Belles and Lamm, I suppose it'd be valuable to determine which definition of balanced applies to their amplifiers.

...and whether it truly matters to Sutts.

Sutts, if you have the opportunity to audition some Ayre amps, listen to whatever the dealer has on hand. I think you will find they are ALL excellent. The $$$ MX-R monoblocks are incredible but out of most people's price range. The stereo amps V5xe and V1xe are great performers as well. Hopefully you can audition them with your preamp or best of all at home in your system. I have never heard a speaker that didn't sound great with Ayre--but I have only heard what my dealer sells, Thiel, Vienna Acoustics, Linn, and Maggie.

I suppose it would be up to Sutts. As for me, I could very easily live with the Lamms, they are fabulous amps indeed. I could not say this about Belles though. I had a friend lend me his Belles 350A for a few weeks, a couple of years ago. Very clean and articulate, but rather thin and edgy sounding to me. My friend agreed and sold the amp about a month after I returned it to him. Maybe the newer Belles gear is better, and worth another listen. I wouldn't buy one, but would certainly audition one again if possible.

It's funny how we all listen to the same gear, but have different impressions. As Sarah (Sc53) mentions that Ayre has a gorgeous tube-like sound to her. I've heard Ayre equipment on several occasions (not the MR-X's though). I do agree with her assessment that they have lots of power on the low end, and would even add that they are dynamic, extended and transparent. However, never once when listening to Ayre gear did I ever think 'tube-like' sound....at all.
It's all about system synergy and personal tastes I suppose.....in which case, you're on your own Sutts....sorry.

Cheers,
John

I have owned the Monarchy SE160's twice! I loved them and the mids are wonderful. I would say the mids are certainly more forward compared to Belles. However on my Dali Grand speakers and paired with a very good tubed preamp the Belles 350 Reference amps just ran circles around the Monarchy amps in terms of resolution, bass control, power, stage size, purity, highs were far more extended, far better speed and pace.

The Monarchy amps also caused a horrible thump in my speakers making a loud noise and pushing the drivers out when turned on. That is common and usual for the SE160. I got used to it, but it took some time.

I ran two Belles Ref 350 amps for a little while and the sound was effortless and beautiful. I just could not affort two 350's at that point in my life and settled on one for awhile.

I have always liked the sound of Hybrid amps owning several Blue Circle amps and the Monarchy's. When I found the Belles the Monarchy's were quickly sold.

I now own a Canary CA 309 modified to be very close to the newer CA339. It is a 45 watt per channel 300B push/pull monoblock amp. They would be glorious on your speakers, but are not balanced and you have to manage 8 - 300b tubes! Yikes.

The Belles 350 or 150 Ref's as monoblocks would be very good. The new Belles MB01's are much more expensive then used 150/350 reference amps, but I also hear they are as good as it gets at any price.

I don't want to manage all the tubes in my Canary amp, but they stay until I can find a hybrid or SS amp that is as musical. I am trying a Butler 2250 next. 250 watts in a unique hybrid design.

If Monarchy fixed the turn on thump problem with the SE250, then it may be worth trying. More power is also better as the SE160 drove my speakers more like a 75 watt SS amp.

Bill

For P/P, Class A, Triode, the CAT JL2/3 are in the first rank. CAT eschews balanced operation.