zyx universe cartr.- ideal weight -ideal vta ,

I see that the Olympos for sale is the lower output model, just 0.2mv. That's the version we've heard, twice; it's presumably faster and more responsive than the high output version. When I hit the lotto I'm thinking of asking Mehran for an extra-low output UNIverse, just half the length of wire on the coils for .12mv. It should sound incredible and we have enough gain.

We recently had a second opportunity to A/B the Olympos and UNIverse, this time in our system on our arm (last time was in Cello's system on a Schroeder Ref.) Different arms produce different results of course, but we were still surprised.

The Olympos no longer displayed the slight speed advantage it had at Cello's, they now seem dead even in that respect. More evidence that our relaxing suspension is letting the UNIverse become a hair faster? The session at Cello's compared a low hours UNIverse with a well seasoned Olympos, which perhaps gave some advantage to the Lyra (the opposite of our UNIverse/Orpheus session, which gave that advantage to the ZYX).

The only significant difference between these two in our setup was surprising to me, though not to the owner, who referred to the "classic, old Lyra sound". The Olympos brushed each note with the lightest touch of mink (his own term, very apt). It was like the subtlest imaginable Koetsu-ing of the sound, very unlike any modern Lyra.

It was so deftly done that even Paul admired it, and he normally dislikes that sort of coloration even more than I do. While we prefer the more revealing neutrality of the ZYX we could happily live with an Olympos! We can't afford both! Like you we're not collectors of anything but records, and those are for listening.

P.S. The Orpheus would also be on our shortlist of top class favorites and I actually can't think of any others (that we've heard). I expect a fully broken in copy would come pretty close to the other two, with individual differences I'm sure. A more extended comparison with seasoned copies would be interesting.

P.P.S. Remember that nasty, pinch-warped copy of 'Trio' the new Orpheus couldn't track? Well, neither could the seasoned Olympos. Nor can Dan_Ed's XV-1S. There's something about that warp that gives most cartridges fits. For whatever reason, a ZYX sails over it without even pumping the woofers. Maybe some arm/cart magic going on?

Doug: FWIW, the highest-resolution, most neutral cartridge in our lineup is not the Olymos, but the Titan i.

The Olympos has a more artfully stylized sound which undoubtedly makes it sound better on many systems. The Olympos is the one cartridge where we've deliberately allowed ourselves to indulge in poetic liberties (^o^). Probably as a result of this, I've been told by most Olympos owners that they prefer the Olympos, and I've also heard multiple installations where I agreed that the Olympos sounded preferable to the Titan.

But in a really top-flight system and set up immaculately, the Titan i (especially the single-layer coil SL version) shows higher resolution, greater dynamics and neutrality. I've had this confirmed to me by Olympos owners, who found that the performance hierarchy between Olympos and Titan was reversed once they upgraded their systems and also put more effort into the setup. Of course, personal taste also plays a big role, so if someone listens to the Olympos and Titan i in a top-flight setup and still prefers the Olympos, I fully understand.

Remember, when we buy a transducer like a cartridge or speaker (although the same also applies to amplification), we are buying the potential for performance, but not a guarantee of performance. Much of the performnce is up to the component, but the level of performance actually achieved also depends on how much of that performance we can extract, by choice of partnering equipment and setup. And I think that the more neutral and revealing the component in question is, (almost by definition) the deeper you have to dig to get most of the performance out.

I am sure that many of you already know all of this (particularly you, Doug), but it is worth the occasional reminder (^o^).

regards to all, jonathan carr

Doug can you explain to me a bit more about what you mean by cartridge speed. I hear this term and understand it somewhat but wouls appreciate some light shedded on this topic. How does speed effct sound (in general) and why is it a good thing, as it seems to be?

Great thread. Its about the only break I take from listening!

Doug,thankfully warps don't occur with my table(vacuum).Yet my next move,next spring/summer is to definitely get a disc flattener.Gotta have one!!Sometimes you can replay a previously perfect LP,and find a slight warp(sucks,if too big).The Cosmos has most of "those" covered,but occassionally I have a slight problem,which requires my pinching the tubing,to fool the table into thinking it is vacuumed flat.
My Olympos friend(I'm sure Jcar knows him)has the Titan i,and the mono Titan i,plus the Koetsu Coral Stone(I hate him,btw-:).He mirrors Jcarr's thoughts almost exactly,as to performance.BUT what he does(lucky dog)is switch arm wands based on music played.
For all I know,he may have a PC-1,in house as of now.
BTW..he did not win the lottery,but DID get a divorce,awhile back.Maybe,in his case,that was winning the lottery-:)

PS,I am surprised you are loosening up,regarding the "O".What you heard,should still remain valid,unless you heard it again!This statement is "strictly" hobby talk,no agitation intended.
While on the "hobby talk" subject(hey you blocked me,so how else to yenta about stuff),I was shocked that my 2.2 sold in 4 days!!My pal,who I always set up stuff for,did me a favor and sold it for me.
The Phantom is coming much sooner than I thought.Perhaps next week,but my arm board is at Sota.
Truthfully,I am SO worn out from all my playing around and voicing of stuff,that I am NOT looking forward for more scrutinizing set-up work!!
Sorry for my always long winded posts,but some things I can't change.
Best.

Hi Jonathon,

Thanks for getting me more up to date. I haven't heard a Titan i but of course I'll pay close attention if/when I get the chance.

"Artfully stylized" sounds alot like "brushed with a hint mink" to me. ;-) It really was artful, as I said.

Those poetic liberties weren't audible the first time we heard an Olympos, in another system, but they were clearly on display during our recent session. That's a good demonstration of the points you made regarding setup, other components and the neutrality of systems as a whole. The less colored everything else gets, the more noticeable even subtle shades of color become when they're present in any one component.

Of course personal preference always wins out, as you said. This particular Olympos owner brought it around to compare because he wanted to hear it in a system that's more neutral than his own. He prefers a hint (just a hint) of that poetic license. His system has a touch of it and he understands quite well this is why he prefers the Olympos.

BTW, thanks for the nth time for your helpful advice re: the frequency of stylus cleaning (2-3 years ago on VA). We've been religious followers and advocates ever since as you know, to good effect. I've saved any number of "broken" cartridges belonging to others simply by cleaning up the state their neglected styli had fallen into.

Regards,
Doug