New Bel Canto REF600M using NCORE

Sebollo, M22 and Bel Canto Ref600 are completely different designs... Different manufacturer, different circuits, and likely different modules. I would not venture to guess sound of REF600 based on listening to M22.

In general, NCore tends to have a high input impedance, hence compatibility with upstream devices should not be an issue. REF600 in particular, seems to have an input impedance of 200KOhms.... So upstream compatibility should be a non issue.

Downstream, NCore appears to have a damping factor between 500 and 1000, so it is possible that it works best for speaker with normal or lower input impedance... For my Vienna Die Muzik, NCore is a wonderful match.

Regards, G.

On paper the upstream and downstream matching possibilities with these newer ref600s is not really much different than current ref1000m I own. These match and perform well with all speakers I use them with and with most any input. I use 100Kohm unbalanced inputs though 200Kohm balanced is also possible. So these match well with most anything up or downstream but of course the exact nature of the sound will vary greatly still case by case as is the case with most any good quality amplifier.

I'm sorry if my post was not clear. I was not referring to NCORE impedance matching, as both the DIY NC400 and OEM NC1200 designs have all over 100K Ohms and don't present a challenge to the line stage devices.

I was talking about matching or pairing in terms of tonal balance, upstream. NCORE seems to be so neutral and with such an extended bandwidth, that it won't forgive not selecting the right source or line stage (by "right" I mean whatever makes you enjoy, feel the music you like).

NCORE, UcD as well as almost all the high end Class D developments were born, designed and optimized with professional audio performance objectives in mind. The first "audiophile" tuning has to be introduced by the OEM by designing the input stage (sometimes known as the brand sound), and finally completed by the user by choosing the right upstream components, also considering the speakers and room characteristics.

IMHO, it seems that NCORE, being so transparent, makes it a bit more challenging that final "user" tuning. However, if done correctly it can prove more rewarding.

The comment about the NAD M22 was just that, no intention to direct compare with the new Bel Canto amplifier, but in the general Class D and specific NCORE discussions it is worth to notice that it is not very simple to introduce an NCORE based amplifier in a playback chain and expect warranted satisfaction. I tried the M22 with a MacIntosh CD player and tube preamp, the speakers were Dynaudio Confidence C1 MK2. The result was a bit uninvolving, could not get the emotional connection with the music, only admire the resolution and dynamics of individual instruments.

Downstream, I read good experiences using NCORE with a wide range of sensitivities (even 104 dB horns) and impedance speakers, it does not seem to be a problem there.

I think the key to a successful NCORE based system is upstream. And these, as well as Anaview and Pascal, modules are so DSP friendly, that it is only a matter of time until advanced DSP is introduced into hardcore, purits, audiophile devices. French Trinnov and some other brands are leading this trend.

Cheers, Sebastian

Hi Sebastian, now I understand.... And I agree completely with you. If a component is particularly neutral, the components upstream and downstream will be somewhat more responsible for imparting a "desired" or "undesired" flavor to the output.

In my case I have been very lucky.... My trusty old Esoteric X-01, Rowland Aeris DAC, and Vienna Die Muzik speakers match beautifully with all NCore based amps I have had so far in my system: Merrill Veritas, Merrill Teranis (under review), and my Rowland M925 monos... Of course, all this simply means that the sum of the parts match my own particular goldilockian bias *grins!*

Just for the fun of it, a couple of months ago, I inserted into the system my ARC Ref 3 linestage.... And guess what... The overall sound became instantly much darker, warmer... And yes.... Tuby. The changed was much more pronounced than what I would have expected from a linestage insertion. Not my prefered sound by any stretch, but it had great charm in its own musical way.

It will be fascinating to find out what Bel Canto REF600 does for living... And what subtle flavor it imparts to the NCore base. Knowing John Stronczer past accomplishments, I am pretty confident it will be a worthy amp.

Guido

Audio Vision in San Francisco is selling the REF M600 at a discount at $4590.00 a pair and Underwood Hi-Fi will also discount. Sure like to see the engine under the hood and look at John's latest magic he does with his added power supplies. Not sure if the Ref M600 is the latest NCore NC500
but Guido will confirm with his future review.