Is it possible to have Good Imaging close to wall

NVP,

I'll agree to disagree and leave it at that and chalk it up to different goals and expectations, mine being to simulate a live performance as best as possible in order to be fully satisfied. That does not infer a soundstage that is too big, too much bass, or any other defect. These are all just right for me to meet my goals. It took a long time for me to achieve this. Obviously, not everyone has the same goals as me or else the audio landscape out there might look much different than in fact it does.

"However, in most cases this much larger sound-stage is achieved at the
expense of pin-point localisation of the voices and instruments within the
sound-stage. "

Not when done really well. The mbl demo was the best by far I ever heard in regards to pinpoint locations in 3 dimensions, not less. The room had as much to do with this as the speakers. Other designs might do similarly well, maybe even better, but I have not heard it anywhere yet. That includes other 6 figure dealer showroom systems and demos with similar goals done on a smaller scale that I have heard that were quite excellent otherwise.

"Also, since you have mentioned live music, I should say that when it comes to
live music I associate the concept of three dimensional sound stage mostly to
large orchestra, large big bands and choir ensembles."

IT is largely a matter of how the musicians are set up, the room acoustics, and the perspective of the listener from their listening position. In many cases, this all adds up to a less 3-D soundstage at most events for most people, but not necessarily. Things can be set up both live and at home to do way better, if one cares enough to do so.

I will say that though that this degree of 3-D imaging is impressive when it occurs, but its absence does not bother even me that much. In a perfect world, I would want it probably if I had the means to achieve it, but in practice, I settle for a very good imaging system that in my room will probably never match the absolute top notch I have heard to be possible.

Choral music might be the thing that suffers the most when imaging and soundstage is not top notch possible. WHen things click, it can truly be heavenly.

I am not loyal to any brand. Time and technique go on. After time it can and will change. I am Always looking for those tools which excel and give me the properties I want.

I want a deep and wide stage. But within this stage instruments and voices need to be intimate and relistic. Because in this part many sets project instruments and voices too big. At shows it is a mistake you often hear.

The best cables can give you a more holographic image of instruments. You want them round. Many highend systems have depth and wide. But I often miss the extreme sharp image of instruments and voices as in real. When I was listening at the concertroom of my friend, they most exiting part was the voice. I loved the intimate sound of a female voice in real. This made me want this intimate feeling in my system and other systems.

Blacks give you a feeling like singers and instruments are really there.

Speakers are very important, but you need to know were they capable of. Often people only get a few properties out of their speaker.

Imaging is also created by amps, sources and cables for a big part.

Last week I became dealer of stillpoints. These increase also the stage width and depth. They bring imaging to an even higher level. Soon I will write a review about it.

"It is not only the harsh sound. The mid freq. are not that natural and realistic. With classical music a violin sounded a lot different than in real."

With the good mbl demo I heard, these were exceptional with no qualifications, especially when the source was modern reference standard RTR. Vinyl and CD in order were less perfect. That was clearly mostly do to limitations with the source material and format. The differences were never more striking to me than this mbl demo, where the RTR source truly sounded like a real orchestra spread out immediately in front of me with enough size and space to be able to pinpoint ever detail, much like in a high res 3-D image versus low.

It could be that only with a large 3-D soundstage and highly accurate imaging within that resolution differences from format to format can truly be heard. The RTR blew anything else away. Most people have never had a chance to hear the differences in a setup such as the one I heard at United Home Audio.

Same setup at Capital audiofest two different years...meh. THe magic was not there at all. Things were not even close to being properly dialed in, though many sat there and were mesmerized still. I heard many systems better on both occasions, some quite world class, but still not teh reference standard overall including imaging and soundstage in comparison.

You give a good example how difficult audio can be. After 16 years I know that most people in audio are not able to get a stunning and convincing sound out of a system.

Often at shows as in many shops I can hear the limitations in sets. Often it is incomplete. But there are also many brands who do not have the properties ( qualities) to create an image with depth.

2 years ago there was a Naim system with speakers of about 50.000 dollar. It gave a full 2 dimensional image with a voice of about 2,5 metres. At those moments I get very irritated, because this has nothing to do with quality and a realistic image. You must be blind ( deaf) or a big F....idiot to spend this kind of money to a 2 dimensional image.

When I asked a few simple questions about stage and depth, they could not even answer it. Those people sell audio.

"Speakers are very important, but you need to know were they capable of. Often people only get a few properties out of their speaker.

Imaging is also created by amps, sources and cables for a big part."

That's very true. One bad component can completely wreck a system's imaging.