Help! Tweaking My Lovan Rack for new Big A**ed Transrotor Turntable!


Folks, some input would be mighty appreciated.

I’ve been using a hand-me-down (though very nice!) Micro Seiki dd-40 turntable for a number of years and finally got the upgrade itch (it helps the upgrade itch when your cartridge is going on 30 years old, and sounding like it!).

I went down the rabbit hole and picked up a Transrotor Fat Bob S turntable, with an Acoustic Solid 12" arm and a Benz Micro Ebony cartridge. All with only about 30 hours of use at a great price. Yay!

Though I have considered getting rid of my old Lovan Classic rack for a new custom jobby, I’m pretty much spent out and I think I’ll have to make do for now, working with the Lovan.

The Fat Bob turntable is 55 lbs of solid aluminum and built like Thor’s hammer.

I figure this will finally get me to fill my Lovan stands for a bit more rigidity - probably with rice. The stand is the old 3 legged triangular shaped bass, which means the thin MDF shelves can feel like they sit sort of precariously on top. But the stand itself feels quite solid.

I want to incorporate a wood platform base, as many do, because I really love the look of a nice wood slab.

At first I thought maybe I’d have 3 spikes drilled in to the bottom corners of the wood base to directly couple it to the rest of the Lovan frame, vs resting it on the top mdf shelf. But I’m not sure that’s really necessary. And I’d like to incorporate some isolation as well, I think. So I’m thinking of just laying it on the top shelf, with something in between.

My first thought is to place a Symposium Segue shelf between the top of the Lovan shelf and the wood base.

Other than that...I’m flummoxed as to all the other choices...roller blocks? Symposium Fat Padz? Vibrapods? Herbie’s Tendersoft footers? Voo-Doo Isopods?  What should I put between the wood platform base and my Lovan shelf?

Any comments of suggestions on the direction I’m going?

Thanks!

(BTW, I’m an resolutely NOT a DIY/Handy-man type, so I’m not trying to go to heroic efforts, wishing this to be as painless as possible).
prof

Showing 13 responses by bdp24

Though 3" planks of Maple are hot right now, I myself would have some shelves made out of 19mm-3/4" 13-ply Baltic Birch plywood. You could even use two layers, with constrained-layer damping between the two. For the hollow columns of the Lovan, sand will be a more effective vibration absorber than will rice. For isolation, an alternative choice to the Symposium shelf is a set of Townshend Seismic Pods, or Seismic Platform. If you have the $ (over $2000), a serious vibration isolator is the Minus K line of products.
Right, prof?! I wanted to find out how tall the Seismic Pods are, and neither the U.S. Townshend distributor nor any Townshend retailer could tell me. Lame! I just bought a used pair here on Audiogon---when they get to me I’ll post the Pods’ dimensions.
Ha prof, beat ya to 'em! The set I got are rated for 8lbs. apiece, so I can try them under both my tube phono and line amps, and Townshend Rock table. If they're as good as they're supposed to be, I'll get some more---a set for the SACD player and tube pre's, at least. Sources first, then tube amplification. Some people have found them to be most beneficial under speakers, but that can get expensive if you have subs. New, a set of Pods is about $375, for it runs about $1500 for speakers and subs. I'm one quarter Irish, so you know how I feel about that ;-).
I need the next higher rated Pods for my other critical sources myself, as they weigh 47lbs (CD/SACD player) and about 50 (VPI table). Same for the power amp and speakers. But the IsoAcoustic GAIA looks interesting, too. I'm in no hurry, gonna take my time. I would love a Minus K table, but I don't want to spend the over $2k it takes to get one!
prof---While MDF is cheap and easily obtained, it’s not a very good material for a shelf. Think about it; MDF is sawdust and glue mixed together---somewhat non-resonant, but not very stiff. 13-ply Baltic Birch ply (19mm, or 3/4" thick) is very stiff, a good thing in a table platform. A couple sheets of that with constrained layer damping (such as that offered by ASC as wall damping pads) between them will make a great shelf. Or, check out the isolation platform offered by Symposium Acoustics, specifically for tables. It is a layer of foam between two sheets of stainless steel, with special springs on it’s underside. Economically priced, $349 I believe.

To isolate a turntable/arm/cartridge from higher frequencies (above about 10Hz) is easy; a suspended table does that very effectively by having mere springs acting as a mechanical filter. In contrast, very low frequencies "get through" the suspension---most table’s mechanic filters are effective down to only 10Hz or so. That is why seismic-frequency isolation is required by LP players for ultimate performance.

All kinds of material have been tried as very low-frequency mechanical filters---Sorbothane, Navcom, garden-variety rubber. Also cones and spikes of various sizes and shapes. Both of these do act as a mechanical low-pass filter, but their "corner" frequency is too high, rolling off rapidly also at about 10Hz.

The latest attempt to achieve isolation at low cost is with roller bearings---a ball bearing in a shallow cup. As very low frequency energy (vibrations) encounter the bearings upon which the table sits, they dissipate that energy by the ball bearing trying, in response to the wave of energy (vibrations travel through matter as a wave does in the ocean), to climb up the side of the bowl in which it sits. The energy, rather than being transmitted into the table/arm/cartridge, is turned into heat and dissipated by the bearing. Ingenious! Unfortunately, the roller bearing works that way in all planes but the lateral. In the lateral plane the roller bearing behaves just as do cones and spikes---not as an isolator, but as a coupler. If you add a lateral isolator---an air or metal "spring" of some sort---that is effective to as low a frequency as possible, then you can achieve good isolation.

Or, you can spend the $ necessary to get one of the electron microscope isolation table available, which start at around $2000. There is a third alternative, priced between the two, closer to the cheap side---the Townshend Audio Seismic Pods, which have been mentioned and discussed here lately. About $375 for a set of four when bought from England. Look on You Tube for videos of Max Townshend explaining their design and demonstrating their effectiveness.

Oops, right you are Geoff. I gotta remember to proof my posts! The great thing about saying "in all planes but vertical" is that you then don’t need to list them all. Those planes (perhaps "directions" is more accurate?) include, as you have pointed out in the past, not just lateral (horizontal if one prefers), but all related. You used a term for those related planes, which I of course can’t recall. I could never be a lead singer---too many lyrics to remember. I have to make notes on my set list for live gigs, reminding me of what the beginning of each song is like. Lucinda Williams herself actually uses a 3-ring binder containing the chords and lyrics to her songs, placed on a music stand to her side on stage. As she finishes each song, she turns the page to the next song!
prof, the approximately 25 ASC Wall Damp scraps I received are all 4" by between 2.5" and 3". WD is just under 1/16" thick, with a layer of adhesive on both sides, like carpet tape. The odor you refer to, found in the roofing materials (tar paper products) people have been using in damping applications for decades (especially in the UK, in loudspeaker cabinets), is, thankfully, completely absent in Wall Damp.

ASC (Acoustic Science Corp.) offers a product named Wall Damp. It comes in 4" squares (I believe) and long strips, and was designed to act as constrained layer damping when installed between layers of sheetrock. I recently heard it's effectiveness (in Audiogon member folkfreak's music room), which is fantastic! Art Noxon states that the huge 4' x 8' sheets of drywall, when confronted with sound waves and other vibrations, behave as do drumheads when struck---bend, bow, and flex, creating an audible resonance. Rap your walls with your knuckles---they make a clearly audible sound, not a good thing. Folkfreak's walls sounded like slate when I rapped them! Wall resonance is a commonly-overlooked characteristic of the acoustic behavior of listening rooms imo---the final frontier! 

ASC sells the scraps and end pieces from Wall Damp installations by the lb., for real cheap. I just bought a lb., plenty for putting between 1- the two pieces of acrylic (or one of acrylic, one of aluminum; I haven't yet decided) that make up the pickup-arm mounting board of my newly-acquired turntable, and 2- the two 3/4" layers of my table's shelf. I will bolt or screw the two together, with a layer of Wall Damp between them. Sounds promising, ay? I can't see a downside, in theory at least.

prof, for the $18 a lb. the Wall Damp scraps cost (including shipping iirc), it is well worth a try, ay? That buys you about twenty-five 2.5/3" x 4" pieces.

prof, you’ve discovered and proven the "secret" of mass-on-springs isolation: you want the weight of the mass on the springs to be as close to the spring’s capacity as possible, without going over it. Townshend offers the Pods in different models with spring rates in much finer graduations than does IsoAcoustics in their Gaia line of isolators.

I too am not overly impressed with the IsoAcoustics rubber pods (rubber is rubber!), and am sticking with the Townshend Seismic products. I have only one set so far, 3 of the "A" version (maximum capacity 27 lbs.) under my 27 lb. turntable/arm/cartridge.

prof, keep in mind the IsoAcoustic rubber Pods are rated to only 20 lbs each. The company is promoting the Pods for use with sources, amplifiers, and monitor speakers, and the Gaia Isolators for use with floor-standing speakers, which often weight more than the Pods can accommodate.
Turntables are not for lightweights, ay prof?! It takes a lot of work to maximize their performance, but if you have a lot of LPs it's well worth it. Then there is room acoustics!