How to pre clean a very dirty LP before Ultrasound Machine?
Hi all,
Just had 750 of my LP's shipped from somewhere where they were stored in less than ideal environment.. A lot of mold, dust and what not...Not a pretty site...
So i ordered an Ultrasonic (V8) machine to start cleaning my collection. However it seems to me they are WAY too dirty to be put in the Machine as is.
What is the way to give them a pre cleaning? Just rinse with tap water? wipe with a wet lint free optician cloth?
I use a SpinClean with distilled water and the proprietary detergent before the Ultrasonic. +1 slaw. Taking a steam cleaner to them sounds faster. Especially if the were on dish drying racks. I'd only use distilled water in the steam cleaner.
why are you worried, that’s what a sonic cleaner is for. spin clean is not saving you anything, you’re going to use the same amount of distilled water cleaner and more time. I’ve putt some very dirty industrial parts in sonic cleaners, crusted with gunk ,baked on usually and they clean them nicely. Yes you need to change the water more often but you can also rinse after if needed to save time and D-water. You can let the cleaning water get surprisingly dirty if your rinsing after FYI. that rinse could be in a Spin clean too if you have one. no detergent in the rinse of course. oh one more thing particles tend to drop out of suspension in a sonic cleaner. (unless they are buoyant of course)
I also been using steam cleaner with VPI and DIY ultrasonic for years. Be careful if buying one, don't buy the cheap ones at the end of there life span they will start to over heat the water and will or could damage your records. You could also look at Merrill record cleaner. I made a DIY one and it works very well, on bad mold dirty records,better to use it outside. It's a little messy. If you do DIY be sure to make a rubber gasket under pvc cap to protect label.
ANY store-brand "steam-distilled" water will do just fine! I pay $.89 a gallon for SEG water. No need to be neurotic about what brand of distilled water you choose!
A folded-square of Bounty and some Windex (or generic glass cleaner) applied in a spiral motion is enough to clean most LPs before a thorough spray rinse with distilled water - followed by air-drying in a rack. And a new, clean inner-sleeve, of course!
Agree with @analogluvr --if you are in NY you should be able to source distilled water cheaply at a grocery in 1 gallon jugs. If you don’t have a vacuum RCM, you can manually pre-clean. Tap water is filled with minerals and you are adding contaminants. I would avoid. I use a variety of cleaning methods including vacuum and ultrasonic, and for used records, always pre-clean, but that’s me. Sometimes, it is necessary because the ultrasonic alone doesn’t do the job. And you’ll pollute the bath pretty quickly unless you’ve set up a filtering system, something that’s been discussed here and elsewhere at length. I like AIVS No. 15 as a stronger cleaner but it requires some agitation and you don’t want to be scrubbing a dirty record. So, I’ll often clean to try to get most of the particulate matter off, using a mild cleaner - i like the Hannl (which Syntax here turned me onto) but any decent record cleaning fluid will do. Then I do the more rigorous cleaning with the AIVS No. 15 if warranted. (Those Disc Doctor or MoFi applicators work pretty well for this, better than a brush in my estimation, for the more vigorous agitation, though they require pre-wetting which uses more fluid). You might be able to do US only even with dirty records if you DIY a filtration system for your bath. But, if mold, I’m not so sure. I basically avoid moldy records. I know that some have used Sporicidin for mold remediation. There’s no ’one way’ to do this- but mold takes it to another level and @slaw’s suggestion of steaming might help here. It’s a process you can and should refine as you go, to see what works best for you. I don’t use one method or set of methods for every record, but vary the methods employed based on condition of the record and playback. Sometimes, I’ll work a particular record multiple times. Sometimes, it’s just not going to get improved past a certain point, and requires you to replace if you care enough about the record. Good luck.
$ 9 water is final rinse on vacuum machine, not ultra sonic, I found steam clean works well for mold. I have a shop vac with pvc pipe I cut slit with drimel put mofi cleaning pad on it (DIY wand) put album on old broken turntable with cork mat and then steam and vacuum for nasty dirty mold albums. I did 90 nasty albums few months ago, I found this method goes pretty fast. I don't want to put these albums on my machine or its wand. Just a warning your house will smell like mold may want to go outside.
Reagent Lab water about $9 bucks a gallon at Carolina Biological where I bought it.
Don’t support Carolina Biological Supply. They are one of the most despicable businesses on the face of the planet. They are well known for abusing animals, injecting them while still alive with formaldehyde embalming chemicals.
Will do sleepwalker, looked it up your correct. For me if album has mold spots I through them away. If just dirty and mold smell, steam, machine then ultrasonic.
Get a new, fine-bristle paint brush and some organic dishwasher soap. Suds it up in a bowl with a bit of tap water and run the brush a couple of sweeps around each side. Rinse (yes, even under the tap, carefully, or with distilled if you must), let dry then put the shiny clean LP (for it will appear so) into the Ultrasonic for the final touch. Fast and effective.
Get some Audio Intelligent #15 mix 50/50 with warm water and set the record on a glass. Lavish the surface and let it set on the record from 4-5 minutes. Circular brush lightly with the white brushes from Last.The little white brushes are cheap and durable but can be disposed of without high cost. They are soft so not likely to grind anything in. Rinse with warm, almost hot water and repeat other side. Mix up some Audio Intelligent Down with dirty and repeat, again washing with warm/hot tap water. Down with Dirty mixes up about 5 gallons of cleaner so it's cost effective. Don't worry, the tap water will not deposit because you're going to immediately head to your V8 and use the distilled water of your choice for the cycle. 85 degree water is approved by the Library of Congress. I use a homemade ultrasonic bath, again 85 degree clean distilled water for the final step. No cleaner goes in my ultrasonic. I don't want it on the record surface when all is said and done. I have used reagent water from Amazon, Nerl 5 gallons for around $100 delivered. Couldn't tell a bit of difference in that from good distilled water from Walgreens or Whole Foods. Maybe you can. Anyone who knows anything about the efficacy of surfactants can tell you the temperature of the water ups the activity of the substances attacking the mold dramatically. My ultrasonic has a heater, hope the V8 does as well. If it doesn't just buy a heating wand and get the water good and warm. I air dry because I don't want anything touching the clean surface and towels promote static electricity. Just get some dowels of the right size from Lowe's and spindle the records. They dry in about 15 minutes. I notice the water in the ultrasonic gets dirty a bit quicker when the water is warm, if that tells you anything. A bit too quick to be spending $100 per refill. My record collection got flooded in 1982 and while cleaned at the time, some mold developed on quite a few. This worked for me. Good luck and happy listening.
Just put them in the US cleaner, clean, and rinse. Never tap water. Use the US cleaning water until it’s obviously filthy, then change.
You may have to clean each record twice. Note that not all US machines are created equal: power, frequency, reliability. Also, note that the distance between records is important - the wavelength of sound in water is 1.5" at 40KHz. Cleaning works best if the distance between records is at least that much.
For chemistry, I use distilled water and VersaClean from Fisher Scientific. It’s a cleaner recommended for US which is specially formulated for plastics. The benefit of using Fisher is that it’s a scientific supply company, and their stuff has to work as advertised, or there is hell to pay. Hell administered by the Military Industrial Complex - trouble that nobody needs. Of course, you could use Joe’s Guaranteed Vinyl Record Goop, but why?
Drumbeat, your US cleaner cannot clean 750 filthy records unless you want to change bath at $3 or $4 a pop. As bad as you state condition of records you cant start with agitation. You have to blast it off,if scared of steam you need to break surface tension with chemical let soak flood with distilled water then lightly vacuum until you can use a brush and finally get it in your machine.Living in NYC (my brother lives there) may not have DIY access. You could order vpi wand, $15 shop vac and f****in duct tape, a $10 lazy Susan to spin record. Music direct has chemical and wand
"Drumbeat, your US cleaner cannot clean 750 filthy records unless you want to change bath at $3 or $4 a pop. As bad as you state condition of records you cant start with agitation. You have to blast it off,if scared of steam you need to break surface tension with chemical let soak flood with distilled water then lightly vacuum until you can use a brush and finally get it in your machine.Living in NYC (my brother lives there) may not have DIY access. You could order vpi wand, $15 shop vac and f****in duct tape, a $10 lazy Susan to spin record. Music direct has chemical and wand"
Yes- I bought a steamer. Ill do the Steam blast first and then to the US. Any word on how to do the steam? Anything in the water(alcohol etc.) or just water steam?
Any word on steam temperature and distance from LP?
I don't know if you can control temp, try to keep it a couple inches away. I use distilled water in steamer. There are you tube videos out there. I'm not trying to make it complicated but you still need a way to remove dirty steamed water. Only way I know is to vacuum. i would think a cloth rag will scratch album and you would need a lot of rags. Vacuum wand may scratch also but if you flood album with distilled water with spray bottle over steam water and vacuum lightly puddle of water not record your odds are better for less damage. This process is going to be a pain in the a$$ but there is a clean pristine record under all the crap.
Mobile Fidelity enzyme cleaner $29, Audio Intellagent enzyme $37, both at Music Direct, there both good, 750 records I would go cheap, be sure to rinse off enzyme cleaner off with water or a record wash cleaner. Music direct has 50 record sleeves a brush and record wash for package deal of $39. That would through u into free shipping deal.
Question for the chemistry crowd out there. Regarding enzyme cleaners, I have read that they have a very short life span(i.e. ~24 hours). That's why Walker Audio's enzyme is a powder that gets mixed with fluid to activate it for each cleaning session. How do these other more affordable enzymes overcome that issue? Or is the premise snake oil? Cheers, Spencer
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