Oregonpapa, I told you :-).
Good that there are no surprises. This cartridge benefits quite a bit from break in, so wait for about 100 hours as you hear it improve during this period. It will become more liquid and vanish totally. The fact that it is affordable is probably its only detraction. Recently I heard a Dynavector Te Kaitora Rua, I liked it a lot but it still could not beat the ART9. That Dynavector costs around $3500.
Now sit back and enjoy the ride, as every good record is going to make you feel either you are in a studio or a live setting. |
Hey, thanks for calling me out else I would have missed the thread :-) |
Thats a nice video Oregonpapa.
The ART9 in my case took about 150 hours to fully settle down and lose all artefacts. I dont know why it is even considered as a budget cartridge (just because it retails for $1k ?). I currently use a top tier phonostage (Naim SuperLine with Supercap) and this cartridge really makes me feel that my Naim phonostage is one of the best investment of my system. I use the ART9 with an SME M2-12 tonearm which is actually not suppose to be a great match because the big SME is used with lower compliance carts. But the ART9 is sounding wonderful on it. In the past I have tried some very expensive tonearms too but this SME + ART9 combo remains unbeatable by a wide margin. However as Tablejockey mentioned, there is hardly any reviews about these products. At least I know that in Japan the ART9 has receieved many accolades and is highly respected. |
I had the vdh Condor XGM for sometime. I prefer the ART9 any day. |
As per one of the senior designers at Audio Technica, the ART7 aimed for classical music. It is a little more transparent and micro-detailed than ART9 but the ART9 sounds bigger, more powerful with realistic bass which works very well for Jazz, Rock, Blues and Pop.
In any case the ART7 needs a matching step-up transformer to get the right gain. No active phonostage (in my knowledge) will do justice to 0.1mv (even if the specs might suggest otherwise). These very low output carts are designed with SUTs in mind. Take for example the Benz Ebony TR. It is the best Benz cartridge (better than LP-S) but it is not easy to amplify satisfactorily. IMO, the ART9 is a much more rational everyday cartridge which is not below the ART7. |
Scm, be prepared to get a matching SUT if the ASR doesnt cut it. If you cannot budget for a good SUT, it would be a experimental purchase.
I have had phonostages with upto 68db gain and IMO a 0.1 mv was far from ideal with those phonostages. Moreover the extreme high gain section of the phonostage is also the least musical (typically it requires an additional gain stage in the phono to go from 0.5mv to 0.2mv). This additional gain stage handling minute signals doesnt sound as graceful as a good SUT. This has just been my observation based on the phonostages I have heard in the past. |
He he! Oregonpapa, I am not surprised at all. As I said before, this is the only cartridge I will buy again and again when it wears off. It puts me in the middle of the performance or in the middle of the studio like no other cart. The day I hear a more correct sounding cartridge I will post it right here.
Kudos to Audio Technica! |
Thats good new Tablejockey! If the AT50 can supercede the ART9, we all have something to look up to. |
Being excited about a new item in the system is a routine affair for most audiophiles. In fact it is one of the things that keeps us going. Even a little isolation device under an amp can bring excitement into the game. But it doesnt mean that every such excitement is yet another infatuation. When you hit upon something really genuine and pure you just know it. At this point one feels fortunate. It is extremely rare to come across such products. Such products do not come out of hit and trial (which most audio designers today do get a desired voicing). The ART-9 is seriously engineered and it is easy to hear it. |
Never heard the ART-2000 Chakster. |
Here is an interesting update:
I bought my ART9 for USD 1k about a year back. I live in Singapore so I bought it directly from the local dealer. Here Japanese products are relatively cheaper than in US. Just yesterday a friend of mine inquired for the ART9 from the same dealer, he was quoted USD 1.5k. Supposedly Audio Technica has revised the prices of their reference carts. Now I am sure the ART9 will sell more than ever since its no more a "budget prices" cart :-). And even AT has realized it sooner than later!! |
Bill_k, if it continues to stay that cheap in the US, its a good news for all we AT fans. Though I doubt that will happen. |
Oregonpapa, what phonostage are you using and what is the loading you have set for the ART9 ? |
Here is an interesting update:
I bought my ART9 for USD 1k about a year back. I live in Singapore so I bought it directly from the local dealer. Here Japanese products are relatively cheaper than in US. Just yesterday a friend of mine inquired for the ART9 from the same dealer, he was quoted USD 1.5k. Supposedly Audio Technica has revised the prices of their reference carts. Now I am sure the ART9 will sell more than ever since its no more a "budget prices" cart :-). And even AT has realized it sooner than later!! |
I use the ART9 with SME M2-12 tonearm which is a 12" tonearm with effective mass of 14 grams (without cartridge). It is sounding superb! |
Dodgealum, the ART9 is the only $1k cartridge that sounds like a $5k cart. |
Dodgealum, get ready for a pleasant surprise :-) |
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Here are some measurements of ART-9. I got it from Audio Technica:
http://wikisend.com/download/182928/AT-ART9.pdf |
Hey thanks again Oregonpapa. It feels great to see that something I learnt turned out to be helpful to fellow audiophiles too. In this hobby where everything is subjective, very few such components appear in the scene that has such universal appeal. Some thing must be very right about the design and implementation of this cartridge. |
I actually felt the complete break in took about 100 hours. Around that time I felt that the cartridge has disappeared completely without letting any discernible signature of its own left in the playback chain. No more did I feel I could describe the sound of this cartridge in terms like bass, treble, mids, soundstage etc..It all fell into place as one whole piece which doesnt have much improve upon. Super!! |
An update: I played around with resisitive and capacitive loading on my phono stage. The ART9 seems to sound a bit clogged at 100 ohms loading. It sounds much more open and unrestricted at 450 ohms but I also had to add 1nf capacitance to make it sound nice and graceful. In any case, I guess 100 ohms is a bit low for the ART9. |
Hey, nice to see you guys are having fun :-D |
Arm matching shouldn't be an issue at all. It is a typical medium compliance cartridge just like the oc9, Lyra and the likes. Should work with most of the medium mass tonearms. The Pro-ject is also one of them. |
BTW, Audio Technica recommends a "minimum" of 100 ohms for loading the ART9. If the phonostage is upto the task, a 400 ohm loading is well within the range. |
100 ohms is minimum, in my experience it loads the cart down a bit too much. Start with 130 ohms, you may need loading values up to 250 ohms if your capacitance is very low. You can go up to 600 ohms if you can increase capacitance. |
Oregonpapa, I am waiting for people who are current users of bigger and more expensive cartridges to try it and share their opinions. I have personally experienced it but lets see how many more come up with such experiences.
It is interesting that when I was still hunting around for a "great" cartridge, there were times when I had 2-3 amazing (expensive) cartridges and I was comparing them with an intention of retaining just one. Today even though I am intrigued to compare some expensive carts to the ART9 I have absolutely no drive within to spend my money, time and effort on such an exercise. It feels futile, waste of time. Mind is complicated, when one is satisfied the behaviour is so different. |
I may not be able to give an exact answer to your question, but I have some experiences to share.
I have owned the Dynavector 17D3 for some time. It is considered to be very dynamic and fast because of its short diamond cantilever. In my system it was at least 3 levels below the ART9. I mean not even worth comparing.
I have heard the XX2 mk2 multiple times in different systems, it is much better than 17D3. It has a consistently smooth sound picture with a some romanticizing the mids and highs. Macro dynamics are good but below ART9. Microdynamics and transparency is also good but well below the ART9. Resolution is also nice but again not in the same level as ART9. In terms of speed and timing (PRAT) it is similar to ART9 but ART9 is still more agile, more quick with transient response.
I also heard the Dynavector Tai katora Rua, it plays similar to ART9 but ART9 is still more vibrant and energetic in sonic picture. The ART9 just does not allow you to think of an cartridge upgrade because of its amazing all-round performance. It gets out of the picture, plays like top quality studio equipment. Even with the Dynavector TKR I did not hear that level of disappearing act. May be the XV1s does it all and betters the ART9 but I have only heard the XV1s once and that is not a good enough auditioning time to make any judgement between them. |
It is currently my favorite and I see no reason to pay more for anything else, even though I could afford it. Exactly, this balancing act seems so elusive and most manufacturers/designers of most audio gears just do not get it, hence they depend upon embellishments to market their products. The day I hear a cartridge that can better the ART9 without upsetting the balance...my enthusiasm in cartridges will again get a spark. Till then I am a laid back audiophile when it comes to cartridges. I hear that Micromagic Magic Diamond is a cart to look out for. Another nice cart that I heard the other day is Acoustical Systems "The Archon". These are all carts made by boutique audio companies who are trying to create products which are less hifi and more musically correct (there are no dearth of "hifi" sounding carts anyway) :-). |
M2-12 has an effective mass of 14 grams. The ART9 performs beautifully on it. |
This is the very reason I have always maintained that the ART-9 is a cart which is as good as or even better than many $5k cartridges. Almost all those big $$$ cartridges are "voiced" to sound special. It is like they have to justify their price tags. The ART-9 is exactly the opposite. It is the lack of voicing that makes it so special. And unlike some products which can sound indifferent or uninteresting the ART-9 has that magical aspect of bringing every bit of the recorded emotions out of the groove. It rocks and boogies as well as plays opera and chamber music with equal ease. With nearly perfect tone, timbre and timing combined with effortless dynamic swings it really is an ART.
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Hi melm,
Yes, like all good carts the ART9 also benefits from being properly setup. I have set it up with the tail just a wee bit higher.Enter your text ... |
IME, the ART9 betters the Dynavector TKR too, so XX2 Mk2 doesnt really come close. |
Enjoy the ART9 Al. Stories like these makes everyone of us happy. As the cartridge breaks in, you will hear more effortlessness, deeper bass notes and overall a sense of dissappearing act that is hard to come by. Which tonearm are you using with the ART9 ? |
Here is an update that may help all our music loving ART-9 owners, I just bought a 47 Labs phonocube phono stage. It is considered a bit tricky to match all cartridges because it is a fixed impedance phono stage which amplifies current instead of voltage. One cannot set any loading impedance on it. Theoretically there is no loss due to loading and the amplification circuit sees the complete signal from the cartridge. Ok, the good news is it is terrific match with the ART9. Just like the cartridge the phonostage has also disappeared in my system. I do not hear either of them, just unrestricted and free flowing music with all its glory and dynamics amplified clean and clear! No sibilance, no noise, no etch, no roll-off, so slowing down (typically due to loading) and no coloration anywhere. If anything I am probably hearing the power cord and interconnects. Kudos! |
Soldevere, it should be a good match though I am not sure if the Aro can bring out all the resolution and extension that the Art9 is capable of. I had the aro too. It is musical and smooth but it is not very high resolution imo |
I have been using this cartridge for the last 2 years and I am yet to spot a single flaw in this cartridge. I have never used such words for any audio gear till date, let alone a cartridge. It is an unusually balanced sounding product that defies any notion about voicing and pricing. Just use it!
P.S: It is still not the best find in my system, those are my speakers. |
2-3 days is too short. I remember being somewhat concerned about the high frequencies for the first 10 days but I let it play. I would say play it for 2 months and then compare it with 2m Black (if you still want to at that point). It takes that much time to disappear. |
Initially keep the VTA flat and tracking force at closer to 2 grams. Loading at 100 to 120 ohms. After a month bring the tracking force closer towards 1.85 grams. After 2 months 1.8 grams. And finally when you feel it is almost settled, get it down to 1.76-1.78 grams. You can also start playing a bit with VTA after 2 months. Not much, just a bit to see if you like a more open sound (tail up). |
Avanti1960, yes initially you will hear some brightness and edginess with this cart. I also heard it and so did my friends. It will all go away in about 100-150 hours. And dynamics are splendid, just wait for it. What phonostage do you use ? |
Sbank, my suggestion on lowering Vtf is not a concept. I just figured it out as I used the ART-9. Initially I liked it closer to the 2 grams mark, probably because the high frequencies artifacts was compensated by some heaviness in the lows. As the cart broke in I preferred 1.8 grams where the sound was very balanced. After 200 hours when things really settled down 1.76 grams sounded most delicate and nuanced without the loss in impact and presence. I suggested this to a couple of my friends who bought the ART-9 and they too concurred with this observation.
My system at the time ART-9 was new:
Nouvelle Verdier platine TT
SME M2-12 tonearm
Naim Superline/Supercap phonostage
Lamm LL2 preamp
Wavac EC-300B amplifier
Tannoy Turnberry SE speakers
Auditorium 23 cables |
sebrof, just for your info I had the Rondo Red for some time too. Recently I compared the ART-9 to the Cadenza Blue, I would say the only area where the Blue and ART-9 were close was their relative neutrality to tone and timbre. In all other areas the Blue was a step below the ART-9. |
Wow! I have been missing from the party :-).
@j_damon Sorry to hear that your first attempt to ART-9 has not been smooth. I agree with what others have said, it must be an isolated case. Generally Japanese have a very good track record when it comes to reliability. Please let us know when you get the replacement unit.
@sbank I will post my system soon. I am now arriving at a system that will stay long enough to be posted in the first place :D
@sebrof Please do share your views on your new ART-9 when you have more hours on it. Its only after the honeymoon period that you know if it was a great decision :)
@avanti1960 Great to hear that your ART-9 is doing well, at least it has improved to a level that now you are not in a hurry to replace it with 2m Black and compare. I know how it feels when a new unit is not performing as good as your old unit and you get desperate to really believe what you are hearing. I wanted you to hold on because I also did that. Please keep writing.
@jollytinker How is your ART-9 doing ? Has the compression in highs reduced ? I saw that you also have a ZYX. I have heard a few ZYX and I can relate to your enthusiasm to ZYX sound. They have a spectacular presentation, huge, airy and very detailed. I would like to get a ZYX 4D some day. However, to my ears the ART-9 is better than the ZYX Airy and the lower models. ART-9 sounds more studio neutral IMO.
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@oregonpapa Thanks for creating this thread and keeping it alive with valuable posts. Regarding the rising top end on MC carts, I experienced it drastically with Lyra and Van Den Hul carts and even though they were very dynamic and lively I could not live with them. I wonder if these artefacts could have been taken care of if one would use a SUT instead of an active stage. After all MC carts were built to be used with SUTs in the first place. Just thinking aloud since I am considering going the SUT route for a change. @almarg I would be grateful to get some advice from you on choosing the right SUT for the ART-9. I am considering Jensen JT-347-AXT with 1:12 step-up, here it is: http://www.jensen-transformers.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/jt-347-axt-112.pdfI was having a discussion with Peter Qvortrup of Audio Note and he emphasized that the primary impedance of the SUT is a huge factor in matching a MC cart to the SUT. He suggested that I look at SUTs with primary impedance in the range of 30 - 40 ohms. I guess primary impedance of the SUT is not the same as the reflected impedance that the SUT presents to the MC cart. The reflected impedance as we know is the (input impedance of the MM stage i.e 47k)/(square of turns ratio). So what do you think about Peter's suggestion around primary impedance of the SUT ? |
@avanti1960 not just me but there are more people on this forum who have compared the ART-9 to the Dynavector XX2 and I personally have even heard the Dynavector Tai katora rua. The ART9 is in the league of $5k cartridges my friend. I suggest you keep patience with burn-in period. The chances are very high that you will discover some thing wonderful than not. One thing that surprises me is your ART-9 is sounding dark and dull..my friend it sounds exactly the opposite IMO. So it is could either be a issue with burn-in or phono stage loading or use of non-shielded cables between tonearm and phonostage. Try to look at these issues my friend. I am not doubting your listening ability but I really feel something is amiss with the way your ART-9 is sounding. |
BTW, I like Dynavector cartridges in general. The XV1s is a cart that I would like try some day. So, it should not be taken as my preference for AT over Dyna as a house sound. |
@jcoehler I have tried the ART-9 on 3 different tonearms ranging from the weird 47 Labs RS-A1, Immedia and SME M2-12. My friends have it on Jelco 9" and the big Thomas Schick tonearms. It works well with all of these tonearms in my experience so I suppose the Ekos should not be a problem. |
@sebrof the slight glare you hear is something I also heard. It will go away by 100 hours or so. |
@audiolabyrinth As far as I have seen and used, the ART-9 should work well with most phonostages which has adequate gain of around 60db and loading option of 100-120 ohms. Which phonostage do you use ? |
@avanti1960 I may have missed it, could let us know your phonostage and the loading for the ART-9 ? Also, would you know the capacitance of your phonostage input ?
Just keep it going for a month and come back to the comparison with your Dyna, it will be fair to both the cartridges and also worth your effort. |
