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Talk but not walk?

Hi Guys

This isn't meant to start a fight, but it is important to on lookers. As a qualifier, I have my own audio forum where we report on audio issues as we empirically test them. It helps us short cut on theories and developing methods of listening. We have a wide range of systems and they are all over the world adding their experiences to the mix. Some are engineers, some are artist and others are audiophiles both new and old. One question I am almost always asked while I am visiting other forums, from some of my members and also members of the forum I am visiting is, why do so many HEA hobbyist talk theory without any, or very limited, empirical testing or experience?

I have been around empirical testing labs since I was a kid, and one thing that is certain is, you can always tell if someone is talking without walking. Right now on this forum there are easily 20 threads going on where folks are talking theory and there is absolutely no doubt to any of us who have actually done the testing needed, that the guy talking has never done the actual empirical testing themselves. I've seen this happen with HEA reviewers and designers and a ton of hobbyist. My question is this, why?

You would think that this hobby would be about listening and experience, so why are there so many myths created and why, in this hobby in particular, do people claim they know something without ever experimenting or being part of a team of empirical science folks. It's not that hard to setup a real empirical testing ground, so why don't we see this happen?

I'm not asking for peoples credentials, and I'm not asking to be trolled, I'm simply asking why talk and not walk? In many ways HEA is on pause while the rest of audio innovation is moving forward. I'm also not asking you guys to defend HEA, we've all heard it been there done it. What I'm asking is a very simple question in a hobby that is suppose to be based on "doing", why fake it?

thanks, be polite

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net


128x128michaelgreenaudio

Showing 10 responses by nonoise

nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
@michaelgreenaudio 

I like your use of "bad" recordings to tune a system. It's only been through trial and error, system tweaking, speaker placement, etc. that I take out some of those old, unlistenable CDs that we all have lying around and now find them better, if not great sounding. It's always been that little test I do for myself. Some of those older, bad sounding CDs can be some real gems.

All the best,
Nonoise
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
Some of us here have been asking the very same questions you bring up only to have it thrown back in our faces. Its the first thing we ask of them: have you tried it?. Simply relating what we hear infuriates some to the point they will do anything to derail the conversation, e.g., bringing up their credentials, their expertise, trying their best to dominate the person and/or conversation, and anything to steer it off into the weeds in order to avoid never trying it, or walking the walk, as you say.

Simply circling back and asking them to try it can make some all the more obnoxious and condescending. They hold it as a grudge and wait to pounce at the opportunity, bringing all their baggage with them.

I've stated before that I've a sneaking suspicion that most of these arguments aren't about the product being debated, but a need of sorts in those individuals to fill some void in their souls. Something latent is driving them to manifest their ire at those who are willing to simply try something by circumventing the norms that they adhere to. It's more a character trait (flaw) than anything else.

Mind you, I'm only speaking of the uglier of those who respond that way and not everyone who holds a contrary point of view.

All the best,
Nonoise
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
For those who don't think that metal cases can't be detrimental to the sound, there's a very old audio site called Mother of Tone that believes one should build amps and DACs on blocks of wood. This is nothing new.

And, +1 for @bill333 

All the best,
Nonoise
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
Research shows that those who've used serotonergic compounds typically have fewer flashbacks of prior life experiences than those who never have.
WTF?

All credibility goes out the window when we go into the weeds.
Stay on topic folks. This was entertaining in a big brain standoff sort of way. 

All the best,
Nonoise
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
Two behavioralists meet on a corner. The first one says to the second one:
"You’re okay. How am I?"

Is that what all of this is boiling down to? 🤔
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
Yes, the mods can be very good at tuning these threads.
I meant, pruning. Or, would tuning be correct?
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
Take care Michael. It was nice while it lasted.
Leave some bread crumbs so you'll find your way back. 😄

All the best,
Nonoise
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
The best lack all conviction, while the worse are full of passionate intensity.  

I wonder if Yeats was a budding audiophile.
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
This is better than reality TV, and most likely born of it.
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
4,382 posts
 
That was like a cross between Jonathan Swift, Aesop and a touch of Ambrose Bierce.
😉
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