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Today's Transport War: Significant Differences?

I have been reading much these days about computer/hard-drive based transports as being a whole order of magnitude superior to traditional CD transports. In my reading, the camp who believes hard-drive based transports can render major improvements has been most notably represented by Empirical Audio. The camp which suggests that traditional CD transport techonology (or atleast the best of its sort--VRDS-NEO) is still superior has been most notably represented by APL Hi-Fi.

Each of the camps mentioned above are genuine experts who have probably forgotten more about digital than many of us will ever understand. But my reading of each of their websites and comments they have made on various discussion threads (Audiogon, Audio Circle, and their own websites) suggests that they GENUINELY disagree about whether hard-drive based transportation of a digital signal really represents a categorical improvement in digital transport technology. And I am certain others on this site know a lot about this too.

I am NOT trying to set up a forum for a negative argument or an artificial either/or poll here. I want to understand the significant differences in the positions and better understand some of the technical reasons why there is such a significant difference of opinion on this. I am sincerely wondering what the crux of this difference is...the heart of the matter if you will.

I know experts in many fields and disciplines disagree with one another, and, I am not looking for resolution (well not philosophical resolution anyway) of these issues. I just want to better understand the arguments of whether hard-drive based digital transportation is a significant technical improvement over traditional CD transportation.

Respectfully,
pardales

Showing 9 responses by jsadurni

jsadurni
210 posts
 
Yes the Reconstrction Theory....
jsadurni
210 posts
 
Almost all DAC manufacturers will tell you transport doesnt matter, EAD manfacturer told me the same, because of the digital-flywheel thingy, Transport is very impotant I would say even more than DAC...

I guess If you destroy the original signal (say in a bad computer or a crappy DVD player) and then reconstruct it on the DAC, the result is not the same as if the signal is kept complete (as much as possible) from transport to DAC.

Thanks for that post Alex, it clears up a lot of things for me.

I hope the Nova memory player is indeed much better than a 10k transport, if that is the case we can say good bye to vinil, I hope its not just the next SACD!!!
jsadurni
210 posts
 
I do believe that the future of digital is through some kind of computer, Mr. Sprey from Mapleshade told me he has a wooden reinforced box for the computer in which he makes some kind of mixing. We all know the quality of Mapleshade recordings (amazing) He also said that going through a computer is hellish for audio.
I do think right now a computer setup can beat most high end players, but not the top notch CD playback systems.
We listened to the Olive and, though very good, when we compared against an Accuphase player (DP-75 I think)the diference was pretty obvious being the accuphase better(both stock) the related system was Halcro electronics and top Dynaudio speakers.

All the Best
jsadurni
210 posts
 
Pardales, have you tried a top transport in your system?
How does it compare to the Hag-usb link?

As always a general conclusion will never be met, but a personal conclusion can be drawn....

I tried computer audio and a good CD transport makes a world of difference in my system, anyway I will some day buy a computer interface with SPDIF and try it out again, maybe the next generation will be better....but I will try again Analog first!!!

When a computer link sounds better than my Forsell in my setup I will be convinced!!!
jsadurni
210 posts
 
The Squeezebox streams digital Wifi and wired (I had less interruptions wired) via Ethernet, the buffer lasts for about a minute, it has an onboard DAC which was modded (power supply, clock, analog output, etc.) It "does stream digital", it sounds OK... "World Class" it is not.
So; all the bells and whistles are there;ram buffer, almost no jitter, Ethernet two way communication etc. one can argue about the implementation probably not being the best, so I got it modded...all the besll and whistles plus a much better implementation...Still sounded OK!
Much better through my outboard DAC, Extremely good with an outboard TRANSPORT!!!!
jsadurni
210 posts
 
Pardales; I hear you man, I was there and I have a bunch of *.wav files on my hard disc, then I noticed I stopped listening to whole CDs, I would just skip through songs, then I took longer looking for that song than listening to it (probably my inexperience), then I realized most of my favorite songs are not the HIT sinlge of the CD, but something I found by not standing up to change the CD, My Favorite movement from Bethoveen´s 9th is the Second while the Coral is the the Hit! (just an awful example, a symphony should be listened from begining to end).

Another thing; for critical listening I just could not bear knowing it could sound better hooking up the machine behind this one...but thats just me!
I am glad it is working out good for you though!
Maybe I will get a Hag-usb and try again!

How many favorite songs did you discover that are not the ones you bought the CD for?

What about vinyl?
jsadurni
210 posts
 
Steve I am probably a future costumer of yours (after analog), I will need my current DAC to sound the same as it sounds with my current Transport..thats all!
I will use a little black box (Hag-usb, offramp, Lynx card, etc.) with a digital output, the input can be USB, Ethernet, Wifi; whatever sounds good!!!

I am soo happy with my cheap DAC, I am thinking twice about vinyl!!!
jsadurni
210 posts
 
The main difference of the Flash memory would be avoiding a spinning mechanical device and the problems inherent to these...
Now we will soon find out that "titanium" flash memory chips do sound better than the "normal" flash memory chips and we will never agree if spinning disks sound better than what kind of chip...untill they sell no CD no more...and we will only find CDs in Vynil sites!!!
We will buy music from sites and down load it to our computers, we will listen to the radio through our computer and if you like the song you can buy it instantly, only the song or the whole Long play...or a seleccion. I am sure there will be playlist sites that sell the whole potpurri like Buddha Bar CDs, those of us with a Good CD transport will have to burn a CD in order to play it from our transport, or will decide to go directly from the computer (which by then will be Full Flash memory anyway) even if it really doesnt sound as good!
But these will be Tomorrow`s Transport War....

Vynil anyone?
jsadurni
210 posts
 
Osgorth, We will need then "titanium" buffers ;-) APL!!!

Almost all DVD transports use buffers since the reading speed is much faster, Squeezebox uses also buffers...even so: they all sound very different, some better some worst.

APL has modded from Phillips to Teac, going through almost all Denons...mods are similar but the results seem to be very different even though the data is coming actually from a buffer!!! Alex, can you clear this up?
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