I was in a very similar position – I had a pair of Merlins at the time that I bought my Frankensteins and CSLS. I also went from a medium-small room to a large room. I’m not surprised about your experience with your Merlins. Mine were a pair of VSM-MXe’s which were a couple of generations older than your Black Magics. The Merlins are rated at 89db sensitivity and 6-8 ohms impedance. That is not a good match with the 8 watt Frankensteins. That combo sounded exactly like you described - thin, lack of bass, and a restricted soundstage. You want speakers that have a high sensitivity rating and with high impedance to get the best out of your SET amps. My other speakers at the time were Coincident Victory II’s, 93-97db sensitivity and 14 ohms. They were a good match with the Frankensteins; really, it was a night and day difference when compared to the Merlins. The Victory II’s are no longer made, but have been replaced by the Super Victory which has an MSRP that is less than the MSRP of the Merlins. The Super Victorys do not go down to 20hz, but come close. I strongly considered them. Have you looked into them?
I ended up buying a used pair of of Von Scheikert speakers that are 99db and 8 ohms. Like you, it was important for me to get full range speakers and the Von Schweikerts go down to 21hz. They are hard to find, though, as only a couple hundred were made. Most of the speaker brands that you are looking at are not appropriate for your SET amps. As for what would work, there are not many SET friendly speakers that go all the way down to 20hz. A few that caught my interest are made by Tannoy, Classic Audio Loudspeakers, and Avantgarde. They are kind of expensive, though. Also, here is a good starting point for speakers that might be of interest to you that would work with your amps: http://www.high-endaudio.com/RC-Speakers.html#SET . You will need to do some research and sifting, as many of these do not meet your 20hz criteria. |
By the way, I would keep the Frankensteins. They are very capable of giving you the traits that you are looking for, when paired with the right speakers.
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Another option would be to keep your Merlins, which are excellent speakers, and find a more suitable amp. I used an 80 watt OTL amp with excellent results, and also tried a 22 watt push pull 300b amp that worked well..
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Thanks for the thoughtful response. Frankenstein mono blocks I have deliver 20W (circuit is internally modified and thus can only take 300b xls and not regular 300b). For most part, I believe lack of power is not the problem. Most of my journey with merlins was with ARS Filarmonia and then with Gran filarmonia. I am definitely nick picking with the flaws of Merlins as they do sound great in a smaller room especially after endless positional tweaking. The weak point of Merlin was always evident to my ears irrespective of the amp choice. (..may be my reference was set by larger Grand utopia). My Eureka moment came by chance when I sent my Gran Filarmonia for service and while it took forever to come back, I purchased a low watt Cary SET amplifier (don't remember the name). To my ears, I had never heard a more purer & relaxed sound. Who knows, may be it was rolled in the top but whatever it was doing, the sound was ultra clean and relaxing. Problem was evident that it lacked power. Everything you said is true with SET. I immediately realized I wanted SET but with adequate power. Finally got the 20W Frankenstein (not regular ones) and I got the power I needed plus the purity of the Cary. Any day better than Gran Filarmonia which I ended up selling. Needless to mention that I did endless tube rolling. But in the end, merlins are just not made for large scale sound stage and somewhat lack the weight overall and I believe this character is more evident in larger space. Having said that, I am addicted to Merlin as it is the most accurate, transparent and neutral speaker I have heard and don't miss grand utopia or Quad 989s (..both different w.r.t sound and $$ economics ). So Merlin has what I am looking for in my system. Just wanted to see if I can improve any further. That brings me to nick pick and the only aspect I could see improvement is what I described.
Having said this, I totally agree that 99db and 8 ohms married to SET would be optimum. This is a good starting point to consider as I search my options. Which Von Scheikert model you have? Did you achieve all the Merlin and then some? What ways did you improve the sound?
Thanks.
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Okay, the fact that your amps are 20 watts clarifies things. Very cool tweak! Seems more of an issue of room/speaker interface.
Merlins are great speakers for smaller rooms, but in my experience, and apparently yours, they do lose a sense of scale in larger rooms. My room with the Merlins was 14 x 13. I tried them in my much larger living room and definitely experienced a loss of scale and soundstage size when they were in there.
My speaker model is called the "db99". It is the second generation of the speaker. It is no longer made. There was a pair for sale here last month, the first I have seen in awhile.
Both speaker models are capable of crystalline clarity and excellent soundstaging and imaging. My full range speakers offer more bass and fill my 24 x 20 room better, as one would expect.
However, it’s been two years since I sold my Merlins and I mainly experienced them with another amp and preamp, and a different set of cables. I never directly compared the Merlins and db99’s. I did briefly try the Merlins with the 8 watt Frankensteins and did not like that combo.
Also, I have changed cables and added tweaks like after market fuses and stands and a rack which I feel have made a positive difference with my system apart from the change in speakers. In other words, I am not able to attribute all of the sonic change I am experiencing solely to the change in speakers. I did buy my full range speakers before all of the tweaks and was thrilled with the speakers ability to fill my room with deeper bass while retaining the best qualities of the Merlins, at least in my mind, for what it’s worth.
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Have you considered adding a sub or two? It might flesh out the mid/upper bass as well as open up the Soundstage without losing the attributes you like. Certainly worth a try. The Rels were always mentioned with Merlin. I too found the Merlins lean in that area regardless of what I tried, even using a custom tube BAM by David Berning which was a significant improvement over the super BAM. I wish I had tried a sub before moving on, just a thought. |
Look at the Dynaudio C2's or C4's. They will give you everything your Merlins give you plus what you are looking for that the Merlins do not. Plus, at least IMO they are gorgeous.
I almost went that route myself (I have the Black Magic edition) but couldn't quite persuade myself to pull the +/- $15k - $20k trigger. Based on your new room size the C2"s may do nicely (not sure about full scale orchestral) and can save you a tidy little sum over the C4's.
Good luck. |
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Tubegroover: I bought two Funk audio 18.0 master/slave subwoofers that I have not integrated yet. Overall cumbersome with BAM in the chain. It would be interesting to see if this ends the quest.
To audition list:
Von Scheikert
Coincident Tech line
Dynaudio (btw, what amp is preferred?)
..(to be contd..)
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If you integrate the
Funk audio 18.0 master/slave sub-woofers
into your system you can do away with the BAM as the subs will take over the frequency band in which the BAM attenuates. Have you looked at the Coincident line of speakers?
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I agree with you brf. You can just lose that BAM with a properly integrated sub system, at least I would give it a try. I know this move would have been considered sacrilegious to Bobby. The whole idea to me IS the BAM being cumbersome, adding more in the signal path. It would seem subs might negate that need and give you a fuller more full range presentation without the need to trade "up". You have a fine pair of speakers with the Merlins. Yes they always had their weaknesses but it was due to a 6.5" driver not being sufficient for full range sound regardless of all the tweaking Bobby did to try to overcome that simple fact. They are simply lean in the mid/lower bass and produce little to no info at the lowest frequencies. Believe me for years I tried and was always told I needed to replace this component or update the speakers to get a "fuller more fleshed" out presentation. I came to the simple conclusion you can’t make a silk purse out of a sows ear. Those speakers require a subwoofer that integrates seamlessly.
Good luck sstalwar. |
Thanks brf. I didn't think of removing BAM altogether. This seems simpler than I thought. I will give it a shot. Funk has one of the finest eq curves and digs deep. I never looked into coincident line and I would try to audition them.
tubegroover. I could not agree more. Merlins are so perfect in every other way that it makes me nervous to change them and end with a different compromise. Funk seems like a logical path.
Thanks. |
The BBAM embellishes with augmentation well up into the mid-range region. You may find that removing it causes more problems than it solves. |
According to the manual, the BAM prvovides 5.2dB of boost at 35 Hz with a Subsonic bass roll-off below 27Hz. Although Bobby M didn't like subs, he did recommend not using the BAM if using subs since the end user will be crossing the speakers over the effective range of the BAM.
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Audio Note AN/E it does everything you are looking for sounds great and is perfectly suited to your amps. Also well under your budget though you can upgrade internal parts and spend as much as you want. I have a pair of AN/J's on the way myself, the AN/E is a bit too large for my small room.
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I have no doubt that the BBAM may effect subjective and measured performance of the speaker well into the midrange region. I’m not convinced removing it and adding a well integrated sub or better two would be a negative at least in my recent experiences with my current monitors where I noted a huge improvement across the board including the midrange and further improvement adding a 2nd sub well beyond anything gained by that BAM whether Berning's tube Bam with 1k worth of premium VCAP and Vishays or Bobby's super BBAM. I only wish I tried a sub when I owned the Merlins, it may have been the answer to my frustration with that design aside from the positives. |
What could be the crossover frequency and slope for integrating Merlins with subwoofer? I have two funk subwoofers that I will try to integrate.
I will keep consolidating the recommendations for future reference. I am sure Merlin'ers would stumble upon these suggestions.
Von Scheikert
Coincident Tech line
Dynaudio (..but not suitable for SET amplifier)
Audio Note AN/E
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I used to have a set of AudioNote ANE's and would like to say they are not as efficient as AudioNote claims and you will need more power to get the best out of them then 8wpc. I also found the lower base regions to be some what one toned but that was in my room and set up. I moved to Living Voice speakers and an very happy. but they will not give you much below 35hz so may not be for you. |
Oh sorry missed that your amps are 20wpc that is more what the ANE's need. |
I own the same speaker
Had the idea also. I called
The man. B. P. He said"" No"" with a hour of explaining and talking about everything fun. He's missed 4 Shore.
He don't know this butt i got some tin 6 strips driled holes attached it to each merlin cones then
Screwed other end in the
Wood floor. There not moving
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Sorry, i miss read your problem.
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@glennewdick great looking system! Curious what you were driving the AN/E's with when you had them? With stuff like this I find it's often less about watts and more about a stiff power supply.
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Interesting discussion! :-)
I can't add any info about alternative speaker choices (given my biases :-) , not that I can think of anything besides some of the speakers already mentioned which would approach close to full range or full range type performance with a 20W SET amp), BUT I can add some thoughts about using subs with VSMs . . .
Many are right, Bobby would not like using the VSMs without the BAM and subs. It can be done though - from what I have just read of the Funk subs on their site and some reviews, given its DSP and crossover point adjust-ability - integration should not be a problem (especially with two subs vs one in my experience). I would certainly give it a try.
Though with the BAM, I would like to point out you can get a very good sub-woofer - VSM system. It has been done.... I have a long time local customer who has owned Merlin VSMs (updated) for many years (With Joule-Electra preamp and a old pair of Joule OTLs). His system is set up in a huge space (the home is pretty much a open barn like space and not a small one - the volume is quite large). Years ago (still in use today with some minor changes) we set up this sub set-up: two large (physcialy twice plus the size of the Funk 18.0's mentioned in this thread) Infra-Sonic (I think that is the name, the company is long gone) passive subs powered by a large 600W/ch Crown Macro ref amp, with Bryston active stereo sub woofer crossover used to set the low pass (top freq roll-off) for the subs.
One output came from the preamp, to the BAM and then to the OTLs. The other output from the preamp went to the Bryston and then to the Crown amp. I did the fine tuning of the level and crossover point by ear (this was around 2000 - before such cheap handy DSP stuff and measurement tools were available!) I wound up running the subs up to around 40Hz. Yes, that meant a fair amount of overlap between the VSM/BAM and the subs in the 30 to low 40s range, but with things phased right the results were/are downright majestic. Whether a big full scale Orchestral work or something like FourPlay, this setup had/has wonderful impact and scale. Jerry's set-up is probably the only VSM based system I've heard that had that big a sense of scale (I'm sure the large size of the room/space has something to do with that).
BTW, in a larger room with stereo subs, I would also try pulling the VSM's wider apart (more so that the approx 6ft Bobby usually recommended) with a bit more toe in. The added fullness/weight added by the subs will help fill things in allowing the speakers to work better further apart - probably give a bigger sense a scale/stage.
Hopefully this tale provides some fuel for thought. I'd hate to see anyone sell their (Black Magic) VSM! :-) - Rich
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A further thought about the BBAM. It allows one 6.5" driver to act as a time and phase coherent point source across a wide range from 2kHz down to 30Hz. This(together with the superb silk dome Dynaudio Esotar tweeter) is part of the charm of the design. For a time I tried a Velodyne DD-15 rolled in at 35Hz. It vastly increased scale and impact, but I could never get the timing quite right, and eventually learned to live with the VSMs sub-less. @tubegroover My VSM and BBAM are both highly modified with premium caps, resistors, cabinet modifications, and a Paul Hynes SR7 power supply for the BBAM. I wouldn't want to be without the modified BBAM. The stock NiCad battery supply seriously limited performance of the BBAM. |
@dgarretson At one time probably 10 plus years ago I had a customers Velodyne (single 15 inch model) on hand... I tired like heck to get it to work well (with my VSMs) in my 11.3' by 20' by 7.5' room with zero luck... the room would just not cooperate. The sub was too big and always made its presence felt in the wrong ways. It takes the right (size) room, good affordable DSP available these days, and more than one sub (IMO) to get a sub and VSMs to play well.
BTW, the batteries in the BAM are not NiCad, they are NiMH (Nickel Metal Hydride if I have it right). I do not doubt that a really good linear supply(s) (you would need two, one each for the positive and negative rails or multiply that by 2 if you want true dual mono power which would be best) bypassing the internal regulators in the BAM would be a improvement though would add substantial cost as well (I think a couple of good Paul Hynes supplies would probably run $1,000 or more, right?)
Cheers
Rich |
@signaturesound Thank you for a very informative post. The coincident technology line stage (Preamp) has two single ended and one balanced output. Manual mentions that two single-ended outputs allow for bi-amping. Does this mean that both single ended outputs are active simultaneously where one would go into BAM to amplifier and the other to Subwoofer? May be this is a question for coincident tech guys.
Also, do you recall where the subwoofers were w.r.t the walls and the merlins?
I see light at the end of the tunnel. Hope funk fixes my issue.
@dgarretson Can you share the schematics of the upgrades done to the BAM?
Also, anyone have any info on how to get the tube mod to BAM?
This has been a valuable discussion.
Thanks. |
Charney Audio Concerto will fill your room with exceptional sound for $22,000!
Your electronics should work perfectly well with the Concerto and with the 3k left over you can treat the room accordingly.
Charney is in Somerset NJ a quick flight from Orlando to Newark Intl.
Contact Brian Charney and arrange for an audition...you'll be glad you did! :)
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@rodge827 do you mind sharing your experience with Merlins and how the Charney Audio Concerto compares to them? How do you describe the sound? Would be helpful to know the general character; strengths and weaknesses, compared to Merlin and/or in general. Thanks.
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@sstalwar & Rich I don’t have a schematic for the BBAM. It’s a fairly simple circuit with capacitive filters and one AD744 op amp per signal phase. The Hovland coupling and filtering caps are easily surpassed. Replace them with best caps you can afford that fit on the PCB. I tried Mundorf SG and later switched to ClarityCap MR. You can also fit Duelund or V-Cap teflon. The stock Caddock MK-132 resistors are very good by high-end standards, but Texas Components TX2575 are more resolving and transparent. The stock AD744 is an excellent op amp. The big move is to re-power the AD744 with an external +/- 12Vdc bipolar linear supply like Hynes, Pardo, or Twisted Pear DIY kit. That means removing the stock batteries and 3-pin regulators from the PCB and running wires directly from the PCB to a panel connector. The current draw is tiny. Yes, a Hynes bipolar supply is >$1K. The others are much cheaper. IMO a well-powered op amp can rival tubes. |
@dgarretson
I'm sure your mods helped a bunch... the Battery BAM is (obviously) built to a certain price level and to have certain features (like the choice of the external raw feeder power supply used because of its performance, cost, and ability to work on any world wide line voltage), but it is interesting to see what you can make of it if you want to spend the time and dollars. :-)
@sstalwar
My customers set-up with the subs is very unique and because of the (huge) room size/acoustics (for ex, the room is easily 3x of yours volume wise) and the subs in use, the positioning of the speakers and subs (even if I had those measurements) would not be of any use to you or anyone else. Most likely, both pairs of preamp outputs are in parallel in your preamp and are both active at the same time.
Berning's Tube BAM is his design... probably only Dave Berning has any idea of what the circuit/schematic is ... With enough time and money, anything is possible and can be built (i.e. a tube BAM), but I think has dgarretson has shown - some mods/improvements to what folks currently have in their hands is probably a more reasonable way to go.
Cheers
Rich
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Rich, great that you continue to support the Merlin community. As good as the VSM series was/is, I wish that Bobby had carried the model forward with a serious update with slam for larger rooms. One idea would be to add a couple more 6.5" drivers to make a line array. Pretty much the same simple two-way second-order crossover, BBAM, and slim cabinet profile, but with increased output and headroom. Nice if you could explore it... |
Dave, you are not the only person who wanted Bobby to make a bigger VSM. Your idea is not a bad one, alas I am not a speaker designer/builder... and the speaker manufacturing business is a very difficult and competitive one (not inexpensive to do either). Right now as well, I have my hands full with running my little retail business end of things, handling Joule-Electra support/repairs/upgrades, Merlin VSM/TSM/BAM support/repairs/upgrades, and also working on getting Ars Sonum integrated amps re-introduced to the American market. All this is taking up much time (and money - spare Esotar tweeters, VSM/TSM woofers, test equipment etc etc).
Something more in my bailiwick (with my EE background) is the BAM - and I have been looking into (its a long term project) some improvements for the BAM that would not be too costly and still work with the current BAMs enclosure, board, etc and make some good sonic improvements.
Cheers,
Rich
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When I imagine a larger sounding version of the VSM speakers I think of the EgglestonWorks Andra. I own the Fontaines which, to me, sound similar to the VSM (without the BAT), and seem to have similar physical makeup. I thought the Fontaines sounded a little richer in comparison. The Andras even more so with terrific bass. |
@dgarretson and @signaturesound : thank you guys for valuable input on BAM. I will try to upgrade the BAM if I stick with VSMs.
So here are the options mentioned so far in this thread. These are not necessarily suitable with SET or low power amp but that is a discussion for another day. So the list :
Von Scheikert
Coincident Tech line
Dynaudio
Audio Note AN/E
Charney Audio Concerto
EgglestonWorks Andra
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I would also add Devore speakers and possibly the new Paradigm Persona speaker line. This is a newer line so not sure if it's compatible with medium powered tube amps but the specs are promising.
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Subscribing to this thread. Longtime TSM owner (my reference since 2000!), always taken care of by Bobby and dreamed of moving up to the VSM. I could have finally afforded the VSM now, and I feel totally lost without him. He is missed.
One speaker I'd consider is the Silverline Bolero Supreme ($15k). Back when I was writing for Bound for Sound, Marty DeWulf told me the Silverline SR17 Supreme was a big step up from my TSM's. Being a big Merlin fan himself, he would not say that lightly. The Bolero Supreme is to the SR17 what the VSM is to the TSM, to some degree. It's efficient and tube-friendly, so might fit the bill for the OP. I'm going to head up to Alan Yun's shop one of these days to hear it. |
@sstalwar old thread but did you end up getting new speakers? FYI I have the Silverline SR 17 Supreme in house and it is pretty much everything I hoped it would be vs. my Merlin TSM-MXe's. I'll probably listen to the Boleros next which I suspect will be an upgrade in many respects over the VSM (though I haven't heard the Black version), and if the SR 17 is any indication, retaining the traditional Merlin strengths of speed, articulation and musical clarity. |
I have the Merlin VSM for a long time - 7 years, in a smallish room, 11' x 15'. Once moved to a bigger, dedicated room with room treatments (14' x 18') the sound was not full enough, with or without subs (JL Fathom x 2).
The VSM are great sound speakers, but not without limitations, like others. For massive passage in classical music it could sound thin in bigger rooms.
Since then upgraded to the Silverline Bolero Supreme. They can play in bigger scale, bigger impact, but less transparency in the mid-range. But the sound stage expansion and more 3D presentation made it a true upgrade. And lot more bass too, and deeper, however not full range down to 20Hz.
Now upgraded to Egglestonworks Andra III SE (circa 2017). Better than the former two in every way, no drawback yet, besides placement which takes some time to optimize. Very happy.
P.S. Had Watt/Puppy 7s in between, not my cup of tea.
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Hi. I own the BM merlin
I find it is bright more so
Then i want them to be
I was wondering what you were thinking about
I have the tube amp bobby sold. |
@twoch Depending on the room - in many occasions the Merlin default speaker setup will sound bright - reduce toe in of the speakers. Bobby said toe in so the tweeters crossed behind your head, work in some rooms but will sound bright in others.
Try toeing them out, a few degrees at a time.
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If the room is somewhat narrow leaving the VSM/TSM speakers somewhat close to the sidewall, toeing them out can result in more reflected energy from the side wall which can make the mids sound more pushed (and staging would be hurt too). So, instead of toeing the speakers out more, told them in further so that the tweeter axis dresses in front of your face/listing position.
In my experience, the VSM/Ars Sonum amplifiers combo has never sounded bright. But, every room and system is different so this is certainly possible, though not probable IMO. I have had customers who wanted a warmer more traditional tube like character from the Filarmonia, and they have switched from the stock JJ E34L to other current production (new, not NOS) EL34’s and they are happy.
sorry for getting off topic. I certainly understand the VSMs are not the answer for everyone’s systems/needs.
P.S. I have a customer using Devore Gibbons with the Filarmonia and soon a Gran Fila. Tells me the combo is great. The gent is a former Merlin owner
Cheers
Rich |
@signaturesound Rich makes an excellent point in regard to the JJ E34L.
Although I consider them one of the best sounding current production EL34 variants, they definitely lean to the more forward and engaging side. Their JJ EL34 come in more balanced, warmer, and even-handed. If someone wanted to back things off a bit, that's a change that will get them moving in that direction. The much overlooked Shuguang EL34B are also worth a listen. For someone with a bit more to spend, Shuguang Black Treasure 6CA7-Z and vintage Mullard EL34 offer even better sound, without harshness.
I've had 2 pairs of Merlins, TSM and VSM. Incredible speakers, and among the best overall. Along with the Vandersteen 2, I can't think of another speaker that covers as many bases and listeners. But no product is without weaknesses or suitable to the tastes and environments of all
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Hey guys, we just took in a pair of VSM with an upgraded BAM with 2 inputs, higher quality outrigger feet by Mapleshade and an additonal zobel network
in black I have the shipping boxes $2500 for everything.
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Would that be a good price for them? The customer upgraded to a pair of demo Vivid loudspeakers with a JL sub.
The Merlins are lovely speakers newer speakers that remind us of them are the Legacy's which have a similar warm tonality and a big soundstage.
Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ |
If you are on the subject of EL34's I can't recommend the Genalex Gold Lion KT-77 highly enough. It's the best EL34 variant I've heard by a large margin and a pretty good value at $45-50 a tube.
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Sorry for being off topic again, but I want to point something out for Ars Sonum Filarmonia (and Gran Filarmonia) owners that may see this thread. The designer of the amp (Ricardo Hernandez) does not recommend using KT77's in his amp.This is not a reflection on the KT77 (I know the new production Genalex Gold Lion KT77 is a very nice tube), but in the nature of the design of the Ars Sonum amplifiers. So, if you want to roll output tubes in a Ars Sonum amp, stick to EL34 (or E34L) tubes please.
P.S. I have tried the new JJ EL34II in my Filarmonia SK and found it very nice (fuller/sweeter - more tubey if you will than the E34L). I also have a customer who has a set of the (pricey) Sophia Electric EL34's in a Filarmonia and is very pleased with them.
Cheers
Rich
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I have an older pair of Merlin's. I have a BAM with a custom made P/S that replaced my battery BAM. I run a pair of old Dahlquist Subs with the Dahlquist LP-1 crossover driven by an 150 watt Musical Design amp. I run the Merlins full and bring the subs in right at 35hz. This really works well in my system. My next step is to have the Black Magic crossover mod done by Rich from Sig Sound. You could try a pair of subs and see if that does it for you. I would also look up Swarm and see if it that might pic your interest.
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Even though I have not made the move yet as I have been experimenting with subs, I thought I will chime in on couple of things.
Needless to say integrating subs is real pain but could be rewarding. I am not there yet but inclined to endorse the route.
@twoch, you might want to reduce the distance between the speakers (bring them closer to 6.5 ft and then move them out to maybe 7ft). IMO they sound fuller when placed closer especially in a narrow room. I like mine toed out where they cross behind the head (my room allows decent distance from the side wall).
@signaturesound, I have no experience with devore gibbons but just checked their website. O/96 choice is interesting as their spec'ed Sensitivity: 96dB/W/M would make them ideal for SET amps.
Wonder if anybody has any experience with these and how they compare to Merlins.
Lastly, we have couple of other good recommendations that I would check.. Egglestonworks Andra III SE and Silverline Bolero Supreme.
One thing that is top on my mind is to upgrade/modify the BAM.
Also, on side note, vintage Mullard El34 were the best tubes I had rolled when I owned Filarmonia and then Gran Filarmonia.
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@sstalwar
Glad to hear it sounds like you are making some progress...
A update from some customers on a few things that may interest you (and others here):
One customer just got a JL subs (one of their e-sub models) and is running them from the speaker connections using the Ars Gran Filarmonia amp and Merlin VSM's with BAM (VSM hooked in parallel with the sub, not through it - blending the sub in below 40 to 50Hz). So far he is telling me that the combo is "awesome"
In regards to Devore's. My customer with Gibbon X's and the Ars Sonum Gran Filarmonia (and he also has the smaller Filarmonia too) keeps telling me the combo is of the two is great (and I should be a Devore dealer)..... My point is the Gibbon X's while not as efficient as the Orangutan series, they do well with tubes - probably not low power SET is the best match for them.
I've heard the Organgatan's at RMAF (I was in the Devore room a couple of times during the show - its was quite good).... while very good, the character is different then the VSMs. They struck may as a bit more robust in the mid-bass and a bit sweeter up top. Very good staging and musicality though - probably a great match for OTLs (Atma-Sphere or my personal favorite - Joule-Electra's) not just low power transformer coupled tube amps.
One final note for VSM owners, I have been making some progress on testing some improvements to the (Battery) BAM - focusing on that would (I hope) make some (cost effective) improvements to it. I have a prototype unit burning in right now.
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i read this thread with deep interest. First of all the size of the room does matter with the Merlin VSM get past 16X16 and they get swallowed up.
First thing that has to be done is the BAM must be inserted into the musical stream BEFORE the preamp NOT after. THE DIFFERENCE IS MASSIVE IN THE BASS DEPT.
2nd thing is go to Lowes and get a pair 12"X12" 1/4" thick steel plate and accurately drill 4 holes to mount directly to the speakers and then 4 holes for the spiked feet into the plate. Massive difference
Then get yourself some amplification that can do the job
My favorite is the Quicksilver 6C33C 50 watt TRIODES (hard to find) but second is the ARS SONUM Filharmonia 30 WATT PER CHANNEL
I also love the DH LABS Deity speaker Cable yes expensive but worth every penny and DH Labs Revelation for all your IC's Expensive but worth it.
Get some Charcroft resistors and some Duelund for the back of the speakers RC network
And finally purchase a HATTOR AUDIO active and passive (combo) about 4K but the best you can buy Arek's top of the line separates preamp as he is making the best attenuators out in the audio kingdom and if your so motivated replace his capacitors with Duelund
All of this combined will make the best sound in the universe.
BUT REMEMBER THERE IS NO CHEAP WAY OUT WITH MERLIN ...QUALITY IN QUALITY OUT PERIOD. IF YOUR THINKING I'LL SKIMP SOMEWHERE YOUR FOOLING YOURSELF. As a gentleman said on Audio Review...."what do you get when a genius workds all his life on ONLY 2 speaker models...you get PERFECTION. "
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