Zerostat Milty really?


Ok. So I have massive amounts of static at times when playing vinyl. So much so that it can pull my arm from my table (Thorens TD-124) onto the platter when removing the lp. I am worried I will ruin my stylus when it hits. So I bought the Zerostat and have been using it according to the instructions and the static is still out of control. Is this thing for real or what? Am I doing something wrong? Please help. 
fromunda

Showing 11 responses by spincat

I tend to agree with whart on static issues. The static is easy to generate but very difficult to kill. After static got generated, they stay on both sides of the record. This is why you still feel the pull or hear the spark after neutralized the static on the top side of the record using anti-static gun. To handle the static issue, you need to get to the sources (can be more than one).  It is difficult to locate the source since like shooting in the dark. it won't be easy for sure. The static on record is generated only when rubbing and record spinning. It is difficult to measure even with right instrument. Fortunately, It is not as complicated as it sounds and can be done.  The "record rubbing and spinning" are the keys. I like to share my experiences of dealing with record static issues here even many people (whart, slaw, voiceofvinly, etc,) have more experiences. Keeping the record, cartridge, and mat as clean at all time. The anti-static sleeve is a cost-effective adds. The goal is to make sure less static on the record before it spins. The record clean process needs to have anti-static in-mind. Based on experiences, the massive amounts of static (like fromunda has) is likely generated by us. The record brush tends to introduce large amounts of static if not grounding well. It tends to brush the dust into the groove. For record cleaning, I prefer wet clean (ultrasonic, record cleaner) and air dry (for last 10% water). I still have few carbon fiber brushes, but not using them anymore. The dust on the record will not have an impact until it gets into the groove. The turntable may contribute the static as well especially the rubber belt drive. Based on experiences, the regular lubrication of bearing and other moving parts (rubbing and spinning) does help.  Grounding the spindle helps better for the metal platter. When record spinning, it brushes the air and accumulate the static over the time. The anti-static guns have a limited effect on this since they only apply before the record spin unless you keeping squeeze it when playing record. The static accumulates on record will affect the cartridge pickup even you do not feel or hear the spark. 
What are the differences before and after applied Milty or spray when saying works well? Is the sonic difference or sparkless? I never use Pfan-stat spray and do not know what it contains. Be wise about whatever put on the record since the cartridge will pick it up as well. We may not see the impact in a short term.
It is good that you monitoring stylus after applied Pfan-stat using a microscope. When looking into record cleaning machines on the market, some of them are talking about deep cleaning needed for the chemical residue for the new records coming out from the factory. I assume that you can see the chemical residue on stylus under the microscope. I am taking a different path. I avoid using record fluid when cleaning my record (using distilled water only) unless necessary. I am very careful about the cartridge cleaning and record cleaning fluids after re-tip my cartridge (and got comments from dealer) a few years back. 

The anti-static gun (Milty) is effective for neutralizing the pre-exist static on the record before playing. The Pfan-stat is good for avoiding the static build-up during record playing. Then, you are covered and will not need to use the electrode. https://midwesttungsten.com/2-thoriated-1-16-x-7-red-wt20-tungsten-electrodes-10-pack/ But, It is always fun to try different kinds of stuff.

Please be careful when installing the electrode so close when playing your collectible record with the costly cartridge. It will be great if you can share the result after using the electrode.
Tried not to say this. But, I will be surprised if the electrode way works besides psychologically. I do not see how the positron got generated on the electrode. Even it does,  the gap between the electrode and record just way too big unless you have a tremendous amount of static on record. The same principle (gap too big) applies if grounding the electrode. I can be wrong.
@skiroe and @lowrider57 may talk about a different issue. A functional Zerostat gun is capable of generating a certain amount positron, but not enough to zep the spark (a large amount of static). A large amount of static needs a very strong an-static device to neutralize it. I tried industrial anti-static blower and furutech destat II (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4HAbC_WDHU). Even those device, it takes a while to neutralize the static. Please aware that the static is existing on both sides of the record. If only treat top side, you will still feel or hear the static when pulling the record from the platter. It also depends on when you apply the zerostatic shot, (i.e. before or after the static generated). You will feel not working if the static generated after applied shot. The source that generating static needs to be located even not easy.
@2channel8, it is good to know that the electrodes working well for you. The cartridge is such a sensitive device (measures from few milli-volts to sub-milli-volts). The static measures mostly from hundreds of volts. The typical thickness of record is from 1mm to 3mm. The impact is there. Most of the people do not hear the impact of static. They feel it because of the spark or pull from the platter. The impact on the cartridge is there even no spark or pull from the platter. It sounds degraded (edgy, fewer details, definition, extensions, etc). There is no turning back after heard how vinyl sounds without static. Just my experiences of dealing with static.

There are many reasons (recording, cartridge, arm, table setup) that some people do not hear the differences. This is also perfectly fine.


(1) Controlling humidity - This will help.
(2) A brush with a ground wire - Not all the brushes the same. You may need something like this to work well. (http://www.analogueseduction.net/anti-static-solutions-cleaning-cloths/furskfil.html)
(3) Ingest or inhale the Isotopes and become bald - It is a NO NO, too big a price to pay. :-)

The SHURE published a research report about "charges on record" at 80's (http://www.shure.com/americas/support/find-an-answer/high-fidelity-phonograph-cartridge-technical-se...). It is a good read if you really want to get to the bottom of static issue. In the "Measurement of Electrostatic Charges on Phonograph Records" section, it concludes that the charges on record are always negative. The "Removing Charges from the Record" section elaborates the details of anti-static devices including zero-static gun type and ionizer/Destat type, etc. It concludes that those kind of devices generate both positive and negative ions.

The Detstat II/III is good for eliminating pre-exist static on record before spinning it.
The good grounding is the prerequisite for the new Audioquest (or similar) brushes to be effective. The typical human body resistance ranging from hundred ohms to hundred kilo ohms depends on conditions. It certainly not as good as a grounding wire. There are some similar products (brushes) using grounding wire. Since the brush is going to touch most of your records (used, new), it is better to make sure it is as spotless as possible.
@lewm, I am glad that you found this article interesting and helpful. I have read and benefited from it for years. Since people participating are from different backgrounds, I tried not to get into technical details, but focusing on audiophile/sonic perspectives.

The (1)  you mentioned is very true. Most of the people do not aware of this since struggling on spark and pull from the platter. Even does NOT produce a significant static charge, it does affect the sonic and the signal that cartridge pickup to a  degree since the cartridge is such a sensitive device. It does not need a lot of static charges for a cartridge to pick it up. I found the sound becomes edgy, fewer details and less definition, etc. Unfortunately, we are calibrating and setting up the vinyl playback by ear and according to this.

There are stages for anti-static treatment.  Stage one:  sparkless and no pull from the platter. Stage two:  neutralize/minimize the static build-up during playing and improving the sonic presentation. 


@2channel8, It is good to know that you have lots of fun of improving the static issues on your system. The stereo system is about seeking musical paradise and everyone taking the different paths. There is none fit all and the best than others. This forum is a great place to brainstorming and for discussion from different perspectives. cheers