Preamp Recommendations Lamm, Ayre K-1x, BAT 31SE

Thanks for the additional recommendations - there are a TON of good preamps out there - all you need is money. I had read great things abou the First Sound gear, and was considering it, but I have two requirements it (and a few others like CJ, Hovland, LAMM) does not meet 1) XLR in/out 2) remote.

Im also considering the VAC Renaissance II. we'll see. I'm convinced that some of the fun in this hobby is the chase - you know repressed hunting instincts....

Artg,
Understood about your requirements. Still, I think you should hear as much of the quality gear as possible in order to see if the gear that you end up buying measures up.
A CAT can be ordered with XLR out, but it will not be balanced. Not sure about XLR AUX in. Of course, not much point in XLR without balanced circuitry. You are right though. Neither unit has remote.

Ethifi,

I haven't heard the Supratek models. I posted on that thread "Preamp Deal of the Century", offering to put my CAT and First Sound up against a Supratek, but there have been no takers. There has been at least one other thread where one or more responders rated the First Sound ahead of the Supratek. Here is one:

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1082540209&read&keyw&zzsupratek+first+sound

Note the responses of Kalan and Noble110. Kalan has posted on other threads about the virtues of First Sound. Kalan and I have the same model of the F.S. which is one level up from the standard model typically sold. For some reason, his seems to be on sale currently here on Audiogon. With that one and a F.S. Paramount on sale, which is one step up from the F.S. Presence Deluxe 4.0 that Kalan is offering, there is a lot of great product for sale right now.

Rayhall:

Is the standard F.S. model the Presence Deluxe II?
I believe you've the Presence Deluxe 4.0 - that's outside my budget.
A used Presence Deluxe II is closer (slightly more expensive) to the price of a Supratek Chardonnay. These are the two models I am considering, given my budget constraint. It's not fair to compare a Chardonnay to a Deluxe 4.0.
One thing I like about the F.S. is the ability to upgrade and presence of local agents.

Edmund

Rayhall-
I full appreciate that the First Sound might be as good or better than some of the other preamps on my list, but my source (Levinson 390S) and amp (Ayre V-5x) both perform *much* better when run in full balanced mode. This is a simple fact, so conceptually its hard to look at preamps that put both the thing feeding it and the thing it feeds at relative disadvantage.....

Im still learing about this stuff, and my gear is in flux as of late, so tell me, do you think Im being unecessarily limiting in my approach?

Edmund,

Yes, the full name of the standard model is First Sound Presence Deluxe Mk II 2.0. I don't know how much better, if at all, the 4.0 is over the 2.0. I have only heard the 4.0. Moreover, the F.S. linestages have many options in the sense that many people send them back for little upgrades which are offered but not reflected in new model numbers. Sometimes, it is hard to know which unit is being offered and what "version" it is. If it is older than 1 1/2-2 years or hasn't been back to F.S. in that time, it is almost certainly not current. The local dealer network, depending on where you live, may not be that deep for F.S. products, but anyway, I think the product is very much worth consideration for how it sounds. Perhaps you'll do an audition of F.S. Presence Deluxe Mk II 2.0 and let ME know how it sounds?

Artg,

I can't say whether you are being too narrow in the way that you are approaching a pre-amp purchase. For me, there are always 4 questions to ask when evaluating anything new:

1. How good can this product sound?

2. How will it sound in my system?

3. If the answer to question 1 is fantastic and to question 2 is only OK, then am I willing to make changes to my system to make it sound fantastic with this new product?

4. How much will it all cost and are the changes worth it, considering the cost?

Beyond that, I am willing to listen to anything, any technology, any price range, even if I am not willing to buy everything. To me, its the only way to learn what sounds good. If, as you say, transparency and vocals are high on your list of "must haves", I can't say how you can rule out the F.S., if you have an opportunity to listen, without trying. These are the things it does exceptionally well.

I agree that you already have fine gear and for you, the answer to one or more of the four questions may mean no upgrade or at least none that I suggested listening to.

You may find that the Ayre preamp a better match to your V-5X and your Levinson player. As I said in my original post, the Ayre preamp and amp (I listened to the K-1 and V-1 combo) did many things exceptionally well. If the V-5X is a step above the V-1, that may be very much a keeper and worth building the rest of your system around, but there is no harm in listening to other things.

Good luck.