Driving Totem Forrests with 40W Tubes???

Grakesh, I really wouldn't have thought that the Sim could seriously having me considering replacing the PrimaLuna. I thought of it more as an experiment in curiousity as I had always heard the Sim/Totem synergy to be great.

As you know, the PrimaLuna was paired with my Arros in a much smaller space and the results were simply phenomenal! Never had an inkling to change anything. Although I loved the space and the music provided with that system, untimatley both my wife and I couldn't listen in that small room.

Ultimately, but HT and 2-channel merged, allowing extra funds to open up to upgrade! ;) The Arros, now in a room 4x+ the size of it's previous home still had the magic, but weren't full enough to flesh out the presentation in the way I would want. This led to the Forests.

I talked with Totem about the PrimaLuna/Forest pairing and they were skeptical of the 40W (even though tube watts). I was pleasantly surprised at how well the Prima handled the Forests, but was curious as to everyone suggesting 200W of SS power for them to really open up.

I brought home a Krell kav-400xi. I did hear the forest open up in terms of transparency, imaging and detail. My wife even said 'like a blanket coming off the speakers'. I chuckled, and she just looked at me odd - I had to reply to her that you are more of an audiophile than you think, but in our world it's called a 'veil'. She had never heard this phrase uttered before, as I don't really use it, but read it all the time. She highly underestimates her listening acuteness! Anyway, the problem I had with the Krell was a tinginess in the highs that could become fatiguing when listening for long periods at loud volumes.

The Sim bests the Prima in terms of transparency, bass control - I think it bests the Krell in this regard too, and imaging. You do give up a little of that 'tube magic', but the Sim has a very warm, inviting presentation that is in some ways reminiscent of tubes. Also, the Sim show no signs of tinginess in the highs at loud volumes. Very pleasant and easy to listen to.

I preferred the Prima to the Krell, because it was simply more musically involving. The Sim is just as musically involving while gaining a few notches in control, detail and transparency. I was up late last night comparing the two, and plan to again tomorrow. I will keep you posted on my final verdict.

Very interesting to me, jho2s. I have the Sim I-5 and am interested in the Totem Hawks. I heard this pairing at a dealer recently and liked it mucho. Earlier, I had emailed Totem about the pairing of an I-5 with either the Hawks or Forests, and they said they think the Hawk was a better match and that: "Although the FOREST is more demanding to drive the I-5 can still handle the load to a moderate/high level. Although it will play to satisfying levels, maximum dynamics would not be reached."

You do not seem to have any issues with your I-5 and Forest. Good one to note.

- walkman

Walkman, no problems here. I don't listen at insane levels, but I have had it pretty loud with no negative side effects that I can hear.

Jh20s,

Thanks for taking your time and patiently writing all the observations you made. I will be very eager to read your postings regarding this comparision you are making.

Thanks
Grakesh

OK, so the winner (for me) is the Simaudio i-5 with the Forests.

Both sound great and the Prima is a little sweeter in the midrange and adds a nice juiciness to the female vocals that's hard to give up, but overall the Sim just offers a little more. A little more transparency, a little tighter imaging and focus and more accurate tonal representation. Many of the things that I found the Krell to add, but without the nasties in the highs - which to me are unforgivable.

The Sim actually attempts what seems to be some tube like qualities, but when pairing it head-to-head with the same thing, tubes do add a little more 'magic'. Although both sound great, the decision was pretty easy for me. The Sim just controls the Forests better.

While I prefer the Sim i-5, I still question if that could be the final pairing with the Forests. I think the 'perfect' pairing may lie along the lines of a PrimaLuna Prologue Three Preamp with a Simaudio i-3/5 power amp, or perhaps the BAT vk300? I think a hybrid system could be just the ticket for the Forests? The i-5 is nice, but I think a little more power could onyl go in a positive direction.