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Acapella vs. Avantgarde

I currently run a Cary CD-306, Cary SLP-05 preamp, and Cary 805AE monoblocks with a pair of ProAc D38's (see system). The combination is sweet and involving, but the combo just does not boogie when asked to play a large orchestral piece, by Mahler/Wagner/Shostakovich. When the volume is turned up, dynamics are poor and the system starts to sound compressed. I suspect that the 50W Cary's simply does not have enough guts to drive the ProAc's, so I am considering replacing them with a more efficient speaker. Since most SET afficionadoes love horns, this led me to look into Avantgarde and Acapella.

I live in Melbourne, Australia. Avantgarde is available through a dealer here, but he does not have any in stock. The Acapella dealer is in Sydney (a plane flight away). I am looking to spend A$30,000 - which will buy a nice Avantgarde Duo, or a secondhand Acapella High Violon.

I have read plenty about the dynamics of the Avantgardes, but my concern is if they have horn coloration. Also, how do they image? Are they sensitive to room placement?

Would the Acapella High Violon's be a better buy, considering the pair I can potentially get my hands on have been heavily discounted? I have read that Acapella's suffer from disjointed sound because of the three different driver technologies (plasma tweeter, horn mids, conventional woofer). How much is this a problem? And are there any room placement issues? Given that the Acapella's have lower sensitivity (91 dB/W/m) would I be achieving a real upgrade by moving from the ProAc's?
amfibius
hornguys
158 posts
 
3m is about the shortest listening distance you can hope for, and it will take PRECISE tilt adjustments at that.

This is based on your listening seat height. The closer you are, the less forgiving this adjustment is, due to the spacing between drivers.

Also, I've never found a room that cares whether you have UNOs or DUOs. The requirements are virtually interchangeable.

Since the DUOs are significantly better, I'd go for them if possible, maybe even used, over UNOs (which are good, but there's a reason 8 DUOs sold for every UNO).
amfibius OP
282 posts
 
Hornguys, what are the main sonic differences between the Uno's and the Duo's? The dealer does not have a set of Uno's, so if I want them i'll have to order them out of sight. The specs say that the diameter of each horn is 70cm less which would help a lot in getting them to fit in my room.

Joey_v, at the moment I am renting and looking to buy a nice house in Melbourne. Don't know if you have been here, but the closer you want to live to the city, the smaller the houses are! It's only out in the 'burbs where you can get a decent sized house. So in short, I don't know how big my next listening room is going to be.
flg2001's avatar
flg2001
543 posts
 
Well, my friend Jacek came last night and he shared with me his knowledge, based on the fact that he owns Acapella Violins and have heard many AG, including my UNOs.

He agreed that the top end of the Accapelas is unbeatable, as well as the overall tonal palette and involving presentaton, on the other hand - he said that the speed, bass impact and midrange purity of the AG (UNOs in this case) were a tad better than the Acapellas.

Hope this additional piece of information helps you out, or any potential AG/Acapella buyer

Fernando
hornguys
158 posts
 
Amfibus, the Duo mid horn is about 2" wider on either side. Since it's fairly directional, I haven't noticed any problems simply placing it wherever a UNO had been installed.

Flg2001, I'd agree with your friend's observation about the Acapella tweeter. Of course the difference is much less with the DUO, as the DUO is using the smoother and more refined TRIO tweeter driver. Even so, the Acapella tweeter, when it's working right, is mighty tough to beat. I'd still give the honors to it, even over the TRIO driver.

It's always possible to find a particular range where a great speaker can beat another. For me the question is, what's the overall presentation do for me? Do I forget I'm listening to a speaker and literally become immersed in the musical experience?

Maybe it's just me, but so often over the years the very thing that was calling my attention to itself became the thing that drove me to distraction later. Even when that part was truly excellent.

So on the whole, with the lusher and more involving presentation of the DUO (not to mention the huge difference in dynamics), I'd take its musical involvement factor in a heartbeat.

But hey, no matter how objective I'd like to think I am, I'm probably still a bit biased.

So ymmv...

Best regards,

Jim Smith
fcrowder
191 posts
 
In response to Fernando's comments, with respect to the Violons, the comparison is probably accurate but will be influenced by the amp driving the Acapella's. Midrange purity is better with tubes, low bass and speed improve with an appropriate solid state amp. The comparison becomes increasingly less accurate as one moves up the Acapella line first to the Campaniles where the midrange horn goes down to 500 hz and even more so with the Triolons which have a bass horn that goes down to 170 hz. In each instance as the bass cut off moves lower there is a concommitant increase in speed, bass impact and midrange purity. I think that the common thread with all the Acapella speakers is the plasma tweeter which is by far the best tweeter that I have ever heard including the diamond tweeter used in some of the Martens, the tonal purity and the seamlessness of the very different drivers. The AG speakers have a different set of strengths but are equally credible. In the end, as you move up the Acapella line, you begin to close in on the areas where the AG's are very strong keeping the areas where the Acapella's are strong.
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