Pros & Cons of Buying an Integrated with Built-in DAC?


I'm currently looking at integrateds. Ideally, I'd like the next one to be my last and I'm wondering whether I need to purchase one with an internal DAC to provide flexibility for computer audio should I be compelled to go that route in the future. Will today's DACs be outmoded 3 years from now? Am I better off waiting to buy a separate DAC until I really need one? I'm confused. Technology is speeding up and my middle aged brain is slowing down! 

stuartk
My kids use an iMac at home and for the kids it's just fine. I look at an all in one integrate as the one box computer, being an Apple or a HP. I prefer to have my computer in separate boxes so if my monitor takes a dump I'm not totally out. No iMac or one box PC/Monitor machine is ever going to outperform a workstation and standalone monitor for the same money. 

There are many nice integrated amps out there with onboard DACs and etc. Can you likely for the same money put together a better combination with a few boxes... yep. Plus if you want to upgrade to a better DAC, experiment with cables to find the sound you prefer you can customize or tweak the sound to your liking as you change out speakers or other components in the future if that happens. 

There's no right answer as some above have noted and you should trust your ears and not the advice of others in the end. Try to drag equipment home from local shops if you can, or buy gear used and if you end up not liking something resale it it likely losing little if any. This is hobby and in my experience part of the fun is experimenting with gear and chasing to put together the best system you can afford. If you want the all in one solution and really think this is the last purchase then maybe this makes sense. 

Best advise is visit some stores and listen and hopefully you can demo at home. If nothing too close to home, then make a road trip; it's a lot of fun visiting new stores.Trust you ears. Good luck.
Stuartk stated he did not need a DAC at present however MAY find use for it at a later date. Also he is intending to keep the integrated of choice for a very long time. There are far more choices available for finding the integrated amplifier that 'float one's boat' when considering all integrated amplifiers, whether they have, or don't have, an internal DAC. I also can't help but believe that those integrated amps that have an internal DAC, where that DAC does not add greatly to the cost, contains a DAC that could be readily improved by an external one.

Searching for an integrated/DAC combination greatly limits options/flexibility in both units. 

Also the need for a DAC will depend on what digital source will eventually be used. Many digital sources (streamers) have built in DACs. 


I'm thinking back to when I was a kid, in bed with a transistor radio, listening to "Love Me Do" on the Cousin Brucie Show, broadcast from WABC in NYC. Enjoying music sure was a lot simpler back then!  The fact is, there aren't many audio stores in the Sacramento area and as a rule, they don't keep demo units on hand. I learned the hard way that a unit that sounds good in a showroom can sound very different at home. Personally, my idea of fun is listening to music, not buying and re-selling gear, although many audio hobbyists do seem to enjoy the latter. In the end, however, I may have no choice. The Peachtree nova 150 arrives today from Music Direct. If that doesn't, as mesch says, "float my boat", I will, in all likelihood, have to purchase something used that I haven't heard and keep my fingers crossed. The Rogue Pharaoh, for instance, although the reviews are all over the place when it comes to describing its sound. The Rogue website touts its "organic midrange and sweet top-end that only a tube amp can provide" but to others, it apparently sounds more SS than tube. At this point, having read through all the comments, I'm most inclined to find an amp I like, and not worry about a DAC.  many thanks to everyone for your input. 
I’m with onhwy61 - don’t discount the positives of a fully integrated unit too quickly.

Ironically, someone above who voted for going with separate units also pointed out that good inexpensive dacs are so easily available, which actually makes the point: good dacs today are like squirrels, they’re all over the place, and they don’t require that you spend $2000 to get one. So if someone like Hegel, or Parasound, or Peachtree, or many others are willing to give you one of those inexpensive good dacs as a bonus with your integrated amp, and save you space, the cost of extra cables, etc. why wouldn’t you take advantage of these combinations of great modern technology?  They're not stuffing these units with poor dacs - many use ESS's best reference 9018 chip.  If they're going out of their way to make your life easier, and give you everything you want in one box, why snub the offer and make things more complicated than they need to be?

Look at it this way - if someone could easily make the case that you can’t get good sound without spending $5000 on a dac, but none of the integrateds came with a dac that good, then you’d have your answer...you’d be forced to buy separates. But that’s not the world of dacs today - you can get great sound from a $300 dac today. So why go nuts sourcing something like that separately, when integrateds are offering that same quality built-in?