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Loudspeakers have we really made that much progress since the 1930s?

Since I have a slight grasp on the history or loudspeaker design. And what is possible with modern. I do wonder if we have really made that much progress. I have access to some of the most modern transducers and design equipment. I also have  large collection of vintage.  I tend to spend the most time listening to my 1930 Shearer horns. For they do most things a good bit better than even the most advanced loudspeakers available. And I am not the only one to think so I have had a good num of designers retailers etc give them a listen. Sure weak points of the past are audible. These designs were meant to cover frequency ranges at the time. So adding a tweeter moves them up to modern performance. To me the tweeter has shown the most advancement in transducers but not so much the rest. Sure things are smaller but they really do not sound close to the Shearer.  http://www.audioheritage.org/html/profiles/lmco/shearer.htm
128x128johnk
timlub
1,649 posts
 
Johnk,  you have a wealth of knowledge and experience,  but your last post just told EVERYONE else that they don't matter. That your opinion/Experience is the only one that is right or counts. 2nd time in this thread that you've done that... I understand that many post incorrect statements in their opinions, but I remember trying to learn all of this 35 years ago and the knowledge that you share can be immense.  In the mean time,  belittling others will only turn them away from you and soon everything you way will turn to just noise.  Doesn't need to happen brother,  we need you to share your wealth.   Tim
inna
5,245 posts
 
Yeah, sometimes one must maintain a totally uncompromising position no matter what. Not good for a discussion, especially when the subject is complex and debatable.
Very nice post, Tim.
mikewerner
93 posts
 
Thank you Tim. At least someone gets the point.
Speaker design has come a long way and active speaker design is pushing the envelope considerably.
I don't keep repeating "optimize the step response" for no reason (another way of saying get the phase and time alignment correct). Physics dictates this. Improved resolution and timbre result. It's not subtle. 
Generalities are not very helpful.
Mike
larryi
1,972 posts
 

Johnk did not say that only his opinion/experience counts.  He simply said that experience trumps speculation.  Unless one has actually heard the type of systems he is talking about, it is mere speculation that modern designs are inherently superior.  I have heard these systems.  A number of people of people posting here apparently have heard these systems and have commented on some issues that they have with the sound of these vintage systems.  I agree with them that deep bass response is limited.  But, there are many aspects to the sound of these systems that I have never heard matched by modern designs--the sense of speed, the incredible dynamics and scale (the feeling that a lot of air is being moved to produce a BIG sound).  To me, these systems are particularly matchless when they are playing softly.  

I have heard a fair share of modern designs and I do like many of them.  None of these systems that I like share a particular technological approach so I would never insist that they have to be time/phase aligned (some are, like the full range electrostatics that I like) or that they must be active speakers.  I would not rule anything out based on technology employed, materials used in construction or measurements--I would insist on listening and deciding based on auditioning the speakers.  That is why I essentially agree with Johnk --experience (i.e., hearing the speakers) trumps all the conjecture about this or that technology. 

salectric
683 posts
 
Johnk is right---Experience does trump conjecture.  How can anyone argue otherwise?  The problem here is that so few audiophiles have actually heard the speakers he is referencing.  My experience is not as vast as Johnk or Larryi but I have enough exposure to quality vintage speakers to give Johnk the benefit of the doubt.  Did anyone here attend the 2011 or 2012 RMAF?  If so you had a chance to hear a matched pair of Western Electric 757 speakers in the Silbatone room.  Not exactly 1930s but these monitor speakers from the 1940s really opened my eyes to what vintage speakers can do.

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