Has anyone had experiences good or bad with speaker isolation or isolation in general ?


hi
i have been enjoying buying and listening to hifi for some 35 years now and have seen many items come and go.I have also been interested in the audio cable discussions and i agree that cables do make a difference how much of a difference is a very individual, and a system dependent situation. There has been nothing that has got me so excited and improved the sound of my system that has ever made me want to really share it with fellow audiophiles until i started to try various isolation products.With so much choice from affordable to very expensive i found the hole subject very confusing and i did not know where to start. After trying lots of various products all shapes and sizes with very different results i decided to read reviews which is something i do not usually do to get some advise.I read a review on the Townshend audio seismic podiums they are isolation platforms that go under your speakers .This company is very famous for isolation ideas and have been around some 50 years based here in the UK they also had a factory in the USA back in the 1980s. I contacted Nick at Emporium hifi  and he agreed to install a pair for me so i could have a listen. My speakers are sound-lab dynastats which i use in quite a small room but with the adjustments give a nice sound. After installing the podiums we both sat down with jaws hitting the floor these podium things completely transformed the sound of my system to absolute perfection. After all this time trying various products under my equipment i have now isolated my speakers and the sound quality is exactly what i believe we all are chasing, my sound-labs are now transparent no more bass problems i have just got one big 3D sound stage the dynastats are now very open with deeper much better bass everything is perfect. I now believe isolating your loudspeakers is the first port of call i was so impressed by the Townshend audio seismic products i now sell them as i have never come across anything that has given my system such a great upgrade , the sound is the same as before but now its just so much better its playing deeper bass but tighter much more resolution and no boom , the midrange is so much more human sounding realistic and spacious with the top end so refined and perfect , is anyone using podiums and had the same experiences i would love to hear from you thank you john 
mains

Barry Diament bolted each of his Maggie 3.7’s onto the middle of a 2’ x 2’ plank of plywood, and placed a trio of roller bearings under the plank in an equilateral triangle. Symposium Acoustics sells their Roller Block Jr. in sets of three, each of the RB’s having two 1-7/8" blocks of black-anodized aluminum into each of which is carved a "bowl". A single ball bearing separates the two blocks, one blocks bowl facing up, the other down. Barry prefers to use only one bowl, with the ball in it being in direct contact with whatever is placed on top of the bearing. Because the ball would depress into the plywood base from the weight of the speaker, Barry put a square of hard tile in three locations on the bottom of the base, one for each ball to be in contact with. He does the same with the bearings under his electronics, but puts the tile directly on the bottom of each components casework. He argues that a ball bearing moving in a single cup has a lower resonant frequency than does the ball in two cups, thereby providing isolation to a lower frequency.

The Symposium Acoustics Roller Block is nicely machined out of Alcoa aluminum, the ball bearing free to move in the bottom of each bowl. When receiving mechanical vibration, the ball "wants" to move horizontally, but since the surface it is on (the bowl in the block) is not flat, in order to move it must "climb" up the side of the bowl. That movement is microscopic, and is what provides isolation; the object under the roller bearing is vibrating, and those vibrations try to move wherever they are most easily absorbed and transferred on. The ball bearings, rather than transmitting vibration through them and into whatever sits upon them (which is what spikes and cones do), instead moves microscopically, using up the energy it receives in attempting to climb up the side of the bowl. The larger the bowl, the lower the bearings resonant frequency, and the lower the frequency to which will the bearing provide isolation.

I don’t know the diameter of the bowl in the RB Jr., but it is not as large as it could be, or as Diament recommends. There is a machinist in Canada making his own version of a roller bearing, in fact two of them. The original consists of a pair of 1-1/2" aluminum blocks with bowls, pretty much an exact copy of the Symposium RB, but without the black-anodizing. Due to demand from myself and others, he has created a second version, one with a larger diameter, shallower bowl in a single block, the shallower bowl thereby, as I said, providing isolation to a lower frequency. This block is machined from a harder grade of aluminum, and polished to a smoother surface texture. The company is named Ingress Engineering, and it has a website with all the details and ordering information. The highest performance roller bearing around, and cheaper than the Symposium Roller Block!

The roller bearing provides isolation in all planes save vertical, hence the need for another form of isolation in addition to it, such as an air bearing or a spring. The Townshend Seismic Pod appears to provide vertical isolation, so may be the only device necessary. Gotta get me some! 

Symposium Acoustics has some nice explanations on their website and they will answer your emails very thoroughly as well:

http://www.symposiumusa.com/technology.shtml

After I tried the rubber/foam pads above on a whim I looked for an affordable longterm, better looking solution that would give the same positive results. I am trying out the Fat Padz soon.
I understand the physics.. I’m just loathe to spend a chunk of money on something that may only have almost imperceptible benefits in my application. Hence my questions about improvements on concrete slab floors..

This seems hard to DIY..

I'm trying to get away from rubber/foam in my system..
hi toddveronne
i have tried soft squidgy feet from various manufacturers under electronics and have always found they soften the dynamics with over blown bass , i then tried the opposite with cardas golden cubes they made the sound to dead and distant i didn't like them at all, if budget is tight clearlight audio RDC cones and bases worked great for me , i didnt hear no negatives just an increase in musical details , i purchased the 20x 1.2 cones with the bases for around 30gbp  i use them under everything now , but i would definitely start with your loudspeakers first , they are designed to go under speakers as well the results under the speakers are not comparable to podiums but for the money they were the best cones i found, theres a company in the uk called music works they are selling a cone made out of peek or something like that rumor is they are very effective but i have had no first hand experience and the rdc cones are a little cheaper and i have heard the results  which are quite good 
@toddverrone. You ask about what to expect from spring isolating your speakers if on a concrete slab? This is exactly the situation I am in, albeit the ground here in NW Portland is quite soft and transmits seismic vibration all too well.

Isolating your speakers on something like the seismic podiums will radically change the way you perceive bass. You will no longer feel bass transmitted via the floor and at first you may perceive this as a diminution in bass but at least in my setup the bass transmitted directly to you is better defined with greater clarity in subtle details and also greater differentiation between shades of tone and timbre. There’s a fuller description of my experience here
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/speaker-isolation-experience-with-townshend-seismic-isolation...

Seperately i I suspect you may find a different effect from roller balls. I have these under all my stands and the effect is more to tighten things up, much like adding herbies dampers to tubes. Oddly when I put apex footers under my power amps it seemed as if the volume level dropped - this is usually a sign of a reduction in the noise floor so I think that’s what the balls do, they help remove vibration manifest as noise. The podiums are quite different in effect