Would you change your amp selection knowing...?


OK - so this thread was promted by some comments on another thread - not wanting to hijack that thread I created this one...

ISSUE: some high current designed amps have an issue with speaker cables that have a high capacitance.
- the amp can be driven to self destruction because of internal oscilation caused by the high capacitance of the speaker cable
- this does NOT apply to Tube amps - i.e. to my knowledge

The amps I know of that are affected in this way are Ayre, Gryphon and NAIM
- only NAIM warns of this up front AND instruct their dealers to let customers know about it

So why don’t other brands warn about the possibility?

QUESTION:
- would it put you off?
- would you select a different amp if the manufacturer warned of this "issue" up front?

Cheers



williewonka
Given that a speaker cable can't be hurt to have a CI matching that of the speaker, its reasonable to expect that the amp should be stable with such a speaker cable. That's why I say that designers have to accept that.


@almarg 

Hi Al,
good spotting. ~<|:-/

Actually, I've never seen the formula Z = ( L / C )^0.5.
Where does it originate?

1) 25 foot length as that is what was shown on the MI/AG site in Fig 4. 

3) I mistyped. Conceptually, the cable LR are in series and the C is parallel with the load. 

4) I understand characteristic impedance. A 75Ω cable is designed to be driven by 75Ω source and terminate in 75Ω load impedances. I dealt with PCB impedances for years in high speed digital and have fixed innumerable CATV issues by changing splitters or  terminating open jacks with 75Ω loads for friends and family.



Hi Ian,

Thanks for the clarifications.

While Zo (denoting characteristic impedance) = ( L / C )^0.5 is an equation that is widely used in various EE applications, I don’t recall ever seeing a **simple** derivation of it. The Wikipedia writeup I referred to on Characteristic Impedance, in conjunction with the Telegrapher’s Equations writeup it links to, provides a derivation, although it is rather complex. Another derivation is shown at this link in the first answer to someone’s question.

Note that in both derivations the bottom line equation which includes series resistance R and shunt conductance G reduces to Zo = ( L / C )^0.5 when R and G are zero, and therefore to a close approximation of that equation when R and G are small enough to be negligible (on the same per unit length basis that is used for L and C). And under those circumstances Zo becomes essentially independent of frequency. Keep in mind also, as you probably realize, that characteristic impedance is essentially independent of length.

Best regards,
-- Al

 I wonder if it's a matter of the math not matching the measurements, unrecognized variables, or errors of another sort?

 For your consideration: (sorry, but most of the links no longer seem to work.)

https://www.audioholics.com/gadget-reviews/speaker-cable-reviews-faceoff-2/speaker-cable-reviews-fac...

 The authors suggest that the supplied RC networks values for the MI 2's could be improved upon, perhaps someone might be able to confirm or refute this. Furthermore, I would be most appreciative(!) if  instructions for construction of the ideal zobels for the MI 3's could be provided.


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