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  3. 135979-20253

We give up perspective to avoid tone controls

Hi Everyone,

While most of my thread starters are meant to be fun, I realize this one is downright provocative, so I'm going to try extra hard to be civil. 

One thing that is implicit in the culture of "high end audio" is the disdain for any sort of electronic equalization. The culture disdains the use of anything other than a volume control. Instead we attempt to change everything to avoid this. Speakers, speaker cables, amplifiers, and power cords. We'll shovel tens of thousands of dollars of gear in and out of our listening room to avoid them. 

Some audiophiles even disdain any room acoustic treatments. I heard one brag, after saying he would never buy room treatments: "I will buy a house or not based on how good the living room is going to sound." 

What's weird to me, is how much equalization is done in the mastering studio, how different pro speakers may sound from what you have in your listening room, and how much EQ happens within the speakers themselves. The RIAA circuits in all phono preamps IS a complicated three state EQ, we're OK with that, but not tone controls? 

What attracts us to this mind set? Why must we hold ourselves to this kind of standard? 

Best,


E
erik_squires
wtf's avatar
wtf
306 posts
 
@erik_squires .. a timely post indeed.

One thing that is implicit in the culture of "high end audio" is the disdain for any sort of electronic equalization. The culture disdains the use of anything other than a volume control. Instead we attempt to change everything to avoid this. Speakers, speaker cables, amplifiers, and power cords. We'll shovel tens of thousands of dollars of gear in and out of our listening room to avoid them.

With so many good software DSP/EQ options these days I can't imagine why some folks wouldn't at least have a listen for themselves. I know quite a few audiophiles (including myself) who decided it was time to move past the disdain and give it a spin. I think Schiit, with the release their Loki tone control, also inspired many to move away from the old way of thinking about EQ. 

erik_squires OP
5,268 posts
 
Many years ago, i had set up a half-assed rear channel system (long before surround sound) that relied on out of phase information (Hafler) and delay lines from a small processor. I used it with a pair of modest bookshelf speakers to supplement my Quad ESLs.

Interesting. I worked for a theater equipment company competing with Dolby. We were also a major buyer of Hafler amplifier modules and probably kept them in business.

We used a similar feature for non-surround encoded films. I wonder who licensed from whom?

Best,
E
onhwy61's avatar
onhwy61
4,163 posts
 
Tone controls are for those type of people who prefer shocks on their motorcycles.  Real riders ride hard-tails.  You should feel the road and not cushion anything.  If it's a bad road, then your backside should know about it.  If it's a bad record your room should boom and your ears bleed.  That's if you're a real a-phile.

Btw, my bike's have multiway adjustable shocks.
whart's avatar
whart
1,930 posts
 
@onhwy61 - have a British friend who loves endurance rallies. Did the Cannonball Baker (not the car one, the bike one) on a pre-war Harley. He was in his mid-'70s at the time. Stiff upper lip and all the rest...
erik_squires OP
5,268 posts
 
I do get some of the anti-tone control arguments. I never thought about channel to channel tracking for instance. Cheap stereo pots may vary widely. I’ve also used cheap pro EQ’s and they were not up to par.

I use a Parasound P7 for my pre, which has tone controls as well as bass management. Honestly I feel they are veiling. I wish I knew more about the circuits to see if they could be improved. On the other hand, the DSP unit I use for my subwoofer and center (sometimes) is as transparent as I could wish for. It is also far too cumbersome to use for basic album to album tweaking. It’s a measure, calibrate, and forget type of unit.

What I wish I had today is closer to the Theta Casanova. Convert everything to digital, and EQ in the digital domain. And I’d like that not to cost $10,000. Also, it has to sound GREAT, which the Casanova did, and was the only affordable processor I ever liked the sound of. Affordable only because it was used. :)

Best,

E
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