sealed vs vented subwoofers

For some reason the full link did not appear in my post above. From where that link takes you, scroll down to post number 19.

Duke

Shadorne, I don't go to web sites to compare my subs to others. I listen to them. Have you ever had a pair of RELs in your house or did you dismiss them on the basis of some specification? Those of us who have been in audio a long time have learned that there is no spec sheet or single measurement that will tell you anything definitive about the performance of any component.

Duke,

I am confused now because you say group delay is worse on sealed? You can clearly see on the links I gave how blocking the port reduces group delay - so how do you explain that? (My understanding is that the port radiates one full cycle out of phase at the tuned frequency - inevitably this implies poor group delay at the tuned frequency and can be seen on most plots on HT SHack website)

My guess is that kick drum sounds better on a sealed sub is probably again the higher group delay and possibly port ringing effects. (Port ringing may even affect mid bass quality)

Stan,

I agree with you that measurements are not everything. However I approach things differently from most - I try to start with good measurements to begin with and then listen for what sounds best to my tastes. It kind of weeds out stuff which simply sounds good but is actually adding coloration.

Have you ever had a pair of RELs in your house or did you dismiss them on the basis of some specification?

No. However I did not dismiss them - if you did go to the HT Shack website you will notice they have EXCELLENT extremely low group delay. Lord appears to design these deliberately with a very low Q and therefore they are not as efficient (play as loud with low distortion) as others but are probably much more musical sounding than many of the subs that were tested - especially on a kick drum. I suspect the REL's would work well with low Q speakers like ATC but I have not tried myself - so this is simply speculation based on the measurements. They also use Volt drivers that have a good reputation. I did not dismiss REL.

Um, I've sold just about every kind of sub on the market over the years, and owned a variety of both. I'd say that, overall, the more musically accurate subs I've come across where "sealed" designs. But then I've had some excellent ported designs.
I would say it depends, and that you can get excellent perfomers on both sides. Sealed usually offeres a tighter more accurate response, seams like, while efficiency and output definitely seem to go to "the port". Still, I've found I can get good results with both. But, if I had to, in a music system, I'd likely lean to sealed. In an HT system, where all out output mattered, or in an undersized application in a larger room, I'd look at ported. Depends.
My favorite music/ht sub thus far has been the Paradigm Servo 15, hands down, in the past. But, I've had some very expensive sealed MTS infinity subs that were stellar as well. So, a lot has to do with design considerations, I'm sure.
I'm no expert speaker builder though...just an observer - lol.
Um, does this help? I can't tell.

Shadorne - my bad! You are absolutely right; sealed boxes have LESS group delay than vented boxes. I was thinking that, but carelessly typed the exact opposite.

That first sentence should read:

"A sealed box will have less group delay than a vented box..."

My compliments on your restraint in not calling me the idiot I certainly appeared to be.

Duke