Reason for buying old/classic turntables

I think the reason for buying a classic turntable is a combination of cost and sound quality. In terms of cost, a turntable such as a Lenco idler drive can still be bought on ebay for a few hundred dollars and with modifications and a DIY plinth compete with tables costing much more - check out the Audiogon thread.

In terms of quality, check out Albert Porter's system, which is high end by anyone's definition. He had a Walker Proscenium turntable, and replaced it with a Technics SP10. Here's what he posted on Audiogon on 11/23/08:

"I sold the Walker four months ago. I made this decision after comparing it long term against my Wenge Plinth, Technics SP10 MK2.

Photographs of it here at Audiogon: http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1193606055.jpg

And at Sound Fountain: http://www.soundfountain.com/amb/sp10plinth.html

I bought the MK2 in Feb 2007, 21 months ago.

During this period, about sixteen listeners joined me in the comparison with only one voting for the Walker."

Also on 11/23/08, he posted after listening to Mike Lavigne's system, that:

"I actually preferred the Garrard [301] with Triplanar and Koetsu Rosewood Platinum to Mike's Rockport with Colibri."

Finally, on 11/30/08, he wrote:

"Although I've only recently posted my decision, testing has been ongoing for 21 months. Nine others who heard the comparison bought this plinth plus MK2 or MK3.

Each person put their completed Technics in place and compared with their reference turntable and arm.

This resulted in the sale of two Walkers (w/Black Diamond arms), a Kuzma Stabi XL with Air Line arm, a VPI TNT with 12" JM arm, a Basis with Graham arm and a Raven.

For this many people to agree on this change means it's an excellent combination."

What this says is the best of the classic turntables - Garrard 301 and 401, Technics SP10, etc. are at least in the same category as the best of the modern tables - Walker, Rockpot, Kuzma, Basis, etc., in the opinion of a number of experienced audiophiles. When you factor in the cost of a classic table against the cost of the modern SOTA tables this makes them at a minimum a very cost effective alternative.

Albert also had a re-plinthed Lenco, which, according to him, he sold only because of space. I have talked with Albert numerous times. I have been invited over. I live minutes from him. I just haven't made time to do so.

Maybe that should be my resolution.

I think, going for vintage Turntables has several reason's:
Price, lot of people out there can't afford the actual units or when they do a comparison, some may find, that the actual units are way overpriced for their performance. Same for Tonearms and cartridges.

But, this is NOT a general rule, Audiofeil wrote good lines about that. Most of vintage I wouldn't even touch, but when the search is done right, you can get an impressing result.

I bought old Micro Seiki, made some improvements with some Know How from today, linked it with a 30 year old Tonearm and a revisited jap. Cartridge and the result is stunning. Really stunning. I listened to endless actual units which aren't even close.

Dear Jlin: +++++ " I actually preferred the Garrard [301] with Triplanar and Koetsu Rosewood Platinum to Mike's Rockport with Colibri." " +++++

this statement could be a learning one because IMHO we are comparing here two totally different " things " where IMHO ( again ) we can't make a precise and absolute comparison on the TT subject because there we have two totally different tonearms ( not only on design but internal wiring ) with two totally different cartridges.

I know very well the KRSP and the Colibri and when we have both perfectly matched to a tonearm the Colibri IMHO is the winner or at least I prefer it.

A more fair and precise comparison ( TTs ) can be do it with the same tonearm/cartridge combination where the only different " parameter " is the TT but in your example there are too many " different " parameters. The same for the Walker/Technics comparison: two different set-ups.

Both examples IMHO can't be conclusive.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

Raul,

I agree, these are not conclusive comparisons. I also left out the qualifier where Albert wrote that his preference could have been due to the different cartridges. However, I think the overall point is that the Garrard was not obviously outclassed by the Rockport in an informal comparison of the kind that audiophiles do fairly frequently.

Also, in his earlier post that I quoted, he stated that comparing the Technics with a number of other top line tables by other audiophiles for the purposes of buying one and selling the other, the Technics was not at a disadvantage. What this says to me is that the best of the classic turntables can compete successfully with the modern state of the art as determined by a purchasing decision including factors of sound quality and cost, a point of view that I think you share considering your own choice of turntables. :-)