]
("Maybe... but not in my typical room set up.")
If your spending $4800 on a receiver for a "typical room set up", might I strongly suggest separates, yes! Again, Outlaw has even the Denon beat at 1/3 the cost!!!!..yes. I've sold, installed, and retailed the Denon for years. Sorry. It's a good receiver...better than most...not as good...not worth $4800 IMO. That's the deal.
("There are no entry level or even mid level processors that can even come close, processing wise.")(refering to 5803)
Sorry, you're wrong. Again, even the modest little Outlaw separates sound better, yes! Connectd Digitally or through the "dirrect analog inputs" for good analog sources.Also, even though the Denon uses good processors. All the interference that's in a receiver increases noise floor, reduces channel sep, obscures detail ultimately, and the transformer must share dubties in driving everything in the thing!..not just the output devices! It has to driver the processors, the lights, the motorized volume control(and similar), pre amp section, amoung others. Power is reduced/compromised, and current is restricted.
Again, I'd take any receiver for a heads up full range with even modest separates, most every time. Separates still smokes receivers.
I can buy anything I want in this biz at "a song!"...and I wouldn't wast my money on any $2k receiver and over!...no chance! Why? Because I know what works from over 20 years experience, and over 1000 systems under my belt!
It's all good though...people can think what they want.
(..."Do yourself a favor, flip through the recent archives of Audio/Video Interiors. Ever wonder why most of these 1/2 million dollar custom home theaters are using receivers?...Could it be that they know something that you don't? Perhaps they realize that the laws of diminishing returns for separates are absolutely ridiculous")
Perhaps they realize diminishing returns? I'm talking about a near $5k receiver!)(doi!....that's a lot) There is no diminishing returns here! That sale is about selling what's "in-stock"! That's it. It's not anything to do with selling the best performing gear for the money. Separates can be had for less than that. Even a $3k pre and $1600 amp combo is less! So there is no "diminishing returns" in respect to purchasing the Denon 5803!...none. Maybe with the 2803/3803 under $2k, but not $4800!!!
They use receivers in "Many"(not all) because these people are already spending WAY MORE THAN THEY'D LIKE on the whole house custom thing!...and probably a dedicated custom theater with all the decore,structures,cabinetry,necessary gear, etc!!! A receiver often works into a budget, or they have it in stock, yes!
I've worked in 6, that's right, 6 high end audio/video stores. I've talked to clients to no end. I've worked on $1m million dollar installs, down to a few thousand. I think I understand the clients, the game, and the compromises.
Often, receivers are a compromise, yes. Still, for best sound, receiver isn't the best bet, sorry.
I'll most all of the separates combo's up against the Denon, yes...in a second.
("so much so, that they've(receivers) become the component of choice for even the most discriminating critic.")
Sorry, critics own pre/pro's for their system, and have receivers for comparison! I know a few of them!
And, receivers are "where the markets at!"..becuase this is where consumers minds are! Receivers sell! That's it. They offer all in one performance packages, which is phsycologically atractive!...thus the prices are often low for features offered, because of competition and demand! It's marketing.
Still, if you chose to believe that receivers are where it's at, that's your perogative. For the more informed, receivers can't hang, don't sound as good, and have serious sonic compromises comparatively. Do receivers sound good, sure some do on their own. Better than separates?...not by a long shot.
("Maybe... but not in my typical room set up.")
If your spending $4800 on a receiver for a "typical room set up", might I strongly suggest separates, yes! Again, Outlaw has even the Denon beat at 1/3 the cost!!!!..yes. I've sold, installed, and retailed the Denon for years. Sorry. It's a good receiver...better than most...not as good...not worth $4800 IMO. That's the deal.
("There are no entry level or even mid level processors that can even come close, processing wise.")(refering to 5803)
Sorry, you're wrong. Again, even the modest little Outlaw separates sound better, yes! Connectd Digitally or through the "dirrect analog inputs" for good analog sources.Also, even though the Denon uses good processors. All the interference that's in a receiver increases noise floor, reduces channel sep, obscures detail ultimately, and the transformer must share dubties in driving everything in the thing!..not just the output devices! It has to driver the processors, the lights, the motorized volume control(and similar), pre amp section, amoung others. Power is reduced/compromised, and current is restricted.
Again, I'd take any receiver for a heads up full range with even modest separates, most every time. Separates still smokes receivers.
I can buy anything I want in this biz at "a song!"...and I wouldn't wast my money on any $2k receiver and over!...no chance! Why? Because I know what works from over 20 years experience, and over 1000 systems under my belt!
It's all good though...people can think what they want.
(..."Do yourself a favor, flip through the recent archives of Audio/Video Interiors. Ever wonder why most of these 1/2 million dollar custom home theaters are using receivers?...Could it be that they know something that you don't? Perhaps they realize that the laws of diminishing returns for separates are absolutely ridiculous")
Perhaps they realize diminishing returns? I'm talking about a near $5k receiver!)(doi!....that's a lot) There is no diminishing returns here! That sale is about selling what's "in-stock"! That's it. It's not anything to do with selling the best performing gear for the money. Separates can be had for less than that. Even a $3k pre and $1600 amp combo is less! So there is no "diminishing returns" in respect to purchasing the Denon 5803!...none. Maybe with the 2803/3803 under $2k, but not $4800!!!
They use receivers in "Many"(not all) because these people are already spending WAY MORE THAN THEY'D LIKE on the whole house custom thing!...and probably a dedicated custom theater with all the decore,structures,cabinetry,necessary gear, etc!!! A receiver often works into a budget, or they have it in stock, yes!
I've worked in 6, that's right, 6 high end audio/video stores. I've talked to clients to no end. I've worked on $1m million dollar installs, down to a few thousand. I think I understand the clients, the game, and the compromises.
Often, receivers are a compromise, yes. Still, for best sound, receiver isn't the best bet, sorry.
I'll most all of the separates combo's up against the Denon, yes...in a second.
("so much so, that they've(receivers) become the component of choice for even the most discriminating critic.")
Sorry, critics own pre/pro's for their system, and have receivers for comparison! I know a few of them!
And, receivers are "where the markets at!"..becuase this is where consumers minds are! Receivers sell! That's it. They offer all in one performance packages, which is phsycologically atractive!...thus the prices are often low for features offered, because of competition and demand! It's marketing.
Still, if you chose to believe that receivers are where it's at, that's your perogative. For the more informed, receivers can't hang, don't sound as good, and have serious sonic compromises comparatively. Do receivers sound good, sure some do on their own. Better than separates?...not by a long shot.