True Sound Works Apogee Diva Ultimate - Any Good?


Based on a demonstration many years ago, Apogee Divas are my dream speakers. Consequently I would like to hear a pair of refurbished Divas versus, say, Wilson WP8 (or Sashas), Magico Q5 (or Q7) and a pair of Sound Lab Ultimate U-1PX. I would love to hear from anyone who has compared the Divas with any of these high end speakers.

My dream is to own a pair or True Sound Works Ultimate Apogee Diva refurbished speakers one day. Am I deluded versus what is available now?
mgattmch
Hello Lloydelee21, The Apogee full ranges are Apogee's flagship speaker. Some may argue that the Scintilla model competes with it but most agree that the Full Range is unquestionably the best save for the very limited production Grand model [which is in a whole other league as it integrates dedicated subs and extremely sophisticated and extensive "support" components including multiple amps to perform at their best].
The Full Ranges are made akin to the "regular" Diva/Duetta 'format/design' but do so at its very best. They require a serious room, serious power, top notch electronics and serious dedicated attention to perform at their best but will essentially take on any loudspeaker I have ever heard...(No, of course I haven't heard ALL the best/latest & greatest but the Full Ranges will make music reproduction in front of you "uncanny").
Thanks Lissnr!!! Sounds amazing. I have looked into the Apogee Grand...that much 25-year old electronics, 6 amps, etc...whew! that's a bit too much 'stuff' even for me.

I currently use the Zanden 4-box, CJ GAT and Gryphon Colosseum (160 watt dual-mono, pure Class A, doubling down to 0.5ohms with a doubling at peak) and drive a 'slightly' modified Wilson X1/Grand Slamm and Velodyne DD18.

If you had to pick one...would you go for TSW Full Range or the Analysis Audio Amphytron? I have heard excellent things about both (of course, there is the 4-panel Analysis Audio Orion too!).
Hello Lloydelee21, If it was a choice between the original Full Range and the "New" Amphytron (I'm referring to it as new because it simply didn't exist 25+ years ago) I would lean towards the Amphytron mainly because of the newer implementation of today's technology and because the Apogee 'house sound' in their original condition were considered by some to be a bit more in the 'laid back' camp whereas the Analysis speakers are less so.
I have a friend who drives Amphytrons with the big Lamm 2.2's and matching Lamm pre-amp (I forgot what the model designation is but it's the big 4 chassis pre) as well as a top-flight transport/dac in a fitting-sized room and it's quite impressive, (as you would hope and expect). Big, open stage, dynamic, expressive and composed... There's not much not to like and hard not to be 'in awe of'...but this is also what you would expect at this level of equipment. It seems that Analysis has been pretty successful with integrating the planar magnetic woofer to the ribbon mid/tweeter assembly. This speaker [obviously] is also available from a current production company and can essentially be ordered/delivered through normal channels.
TSW Apogee speakers are a bit different in as much as each speaker is completely built from the bare frame up by one solitary custom craftsman whose level of expertise and dedication to this purpose has been so refined over many many years of experience that a TSW Apogee is quite simply an [almost living, breathing...] work of art that also happens to produce extraordinary music in your listening space.
Before I start sounding like the head of his sales department (which he doesn't need by the way, as his products are known simply by word of mouth for what they are)let me reiterate that I'm simply a happy customer sharing the last pages of my search for the right speakers (for me)...after 35 years as a diehard audiophile. Rich crafts an Apogee with the same level of attention that a Ferrari receives and I use the Ferrari analogy purposely because that famous car marque almost seems a perfect parallel to the Apogee name.
20+ years ago they would both be described with similar terminology: absolutely exceptional performance (Exotic?!), state of the art groundbreaking levels of design and implementation taken to the "Nth" degree with virtually no consideration for what else was 'out there' at the time...just their own quest for ultra performance taken literally to the extreme.
Then, almost suddenly, picture the company no longer in business...a big part of which stemmed from the very reasons it was so exemplary in the first place and the prerequisites necessary to be an appropriate owner: common to both: the fanatical attention to SOTA details required customers to require the best in associated components and care to perform as designed: best tires/premium fuel, specialists to maintain/tune-ups..even storage and weather conditions for use...and for Apogees: best associated components? check; care to perform as designed? check; room arrangement, speaker placement, cabling... all had to be 'just right' to achieve its best performance.
The rest is history: a [worldwide] marketplace for ultra-exotic sports cars? "check". BUT...( uh oh...) a worldwide marketplace for a speaker brand that only a tiny niche of society called 'audiophiles' can fully appreciate and who must sit in a single listening chair/'sweetspot', have to have large 'door panel' sized monoliths placed well into the room (with no interference by other 'petty' furniture near by) and require everything just right....(not to mention pricing!) just to listen to exceptional music at its exceptional best??? OOPS! Umm, 'Seeya' Mr.Apogee.
Such a sad story...or is it ? Fast forward 20+ years ...technology has advanced (and Ferraris are now better than ever and STILL match their original description) but what of our unfairly cut-down in its prime-of-life favorite speakers?
Enter 21st century technology picking up where the Apogee marque left off due to the echoing outcry from the original owners seeking new life for their beloved speakers. A huge "Thank you" straight to a fellow in Australia known as Graz who undertook the time and expense to start supplying new parts (most importantly the [much improved] ribbon drivers... remember ALL the Apogee 'full range models' are ALL RIBBON drivers )and then a small network of worldwide Apogee service locations where trained Apogee tech's will expertly rebuild and update (now to considerably higher standards than originals)a state of the art Apogee just for you.
Enter Rich at True Sound Works and here we are.
And what of the "New" Apogee sound? Exemplary? Check. State Of The Art AGAIN? Check, CHECK! Specifically speaking the sound no longer has that somewhat overly laid back character but somehow manages to bring all the detail ( AS WELL AS hidden subtleties) to the presentation and as overused as a cliche can be, simply makes a you-are-there presentation, in all its glory. Soundstage, tonality, presence, dynamics (yes), it IS all there and in a completely NATURAL way. It will still demand the best components but the price of [their] entry is justified in the sound.
Comparing a TSW Full Range to the best speakers in the world is like comparing a brand new Ferrari to any other sports car...to compete you had better be bringing your Lamborghini, McLaren, Veyron, Porsche, etc... or you're simply going to get 'spanked'.
On a personal note I have found Rich to be one of those rare artisans who blends completely 'overkill attention to detail'("overkill" is a favorite mindset for me) into every aspect of the building process...engineering & design as well as stunning aesthetics (Do NOT shy away from having him beautifully paint your pair to your own color choice...(Rich is an experienced 'show car' painter as well)... FWIW,I went to every Mercedes Benz, BMW, Audi, Lexus, Infiniti, Porsche etc. dealership I could get to for weeks... taking pictures, writing mental notes/descriptions and impressions until I came upon that perfect shade of that perfect color and my Apogees now add that stunning "Piece of Modern Art" aspect, blending flawlessly into my listening room.
Brand new Full Ranges done by Rich Murry? You'd better be "Driving" something else pretty special to compete with them (or you'll be in the rear - view mirror).
For me, I'm finally done looking. My TSW Apogees ... I can't recommend them enough.
Good luck and Happy Lissn'n.
Thanks Lissnr! Great feedback and surely one I will come back to re-read...often! Congrats on your TSW Apogees...must surely be audio bliss!
Lissnr,

do the TSW Full Ranges have to be bi-amped? Or can they be driven by one stereo amp? I run the Gryphon Colosseum amp so hopeful that this will suffice. Thanks for any advice.