Audio Research ref3, vtl 7.5 vs FS paramount MKII

Salvo, a direct comparison of First Sound Paramount with Ref 3 is a tricky business at best:
First Sound is a single ended design optimized to operate in a single ended system. . . it may not shine at its best when inserted in an otherwise balanced system.
Ref 3 is a symmetrically balanced designed optimized to operate in a fully balanced system. . . it may not shine in a single ended system. . . I know I do not really like its performance when I turn off the balanced signal.

hi there, just thought i'd interject a comment regarding the ref 3 vs vtl preamps. 1. the vtl preamp at approx the same price as the ref3 is the vtl 6.5. there is no mark II edition [mis-stated by guidocorna]. the vtl6.5 was offered after the vtl 7.5 origin, around the time of the vtl 7.5mkII. the vtl 6.5 is the little brother of the 7.5 mkII, sharing the 7.5 mkII technology and is cuperior to the original vtl 7.5 preamp.

salvo: you comment that you have never known a person disastified with their ref3. when, here is one! to be accurate, after a very very thorough a/b with the ref3 and vtl 6.5 , i chose the vtl 6.5. my review of the vtl 6.5 vs ref 3 is posted on audiogon. as mentioned in my review, i have listened to the vtl 7.5 mk II for only a very short while, but it was easily apparent that the 7.5 mkII went the extra 9 yards that the 6.5 does not... and by deduction, would easily outclass the ref3 in some areas of presentation DEPENDING on the other components in the system, incl speakers, amp, cables, current quality, and of course quality of the source components. overall, it is all about system synergy and room acoustics. however, if you are considering the ref 3, i suggest you do some very critical listening in the upper bass presentation with complex / dense orchestra music. also, scores with very rapid sfortzando episodes. transients can lack good resolution, even in music performed on piano alone! this is not to say that the ref 3 isnt excellent. it cerntaily is, but it is not the hands down champion in a class that includes a handful of other top notch preamps in the usd$10k range and above. cheers.

Hi Soundisntmusic, I do stand humbly corrected. I just checked with Bea at VTL and you are absolutely right. . . there is no such animal as a 6.5 Mk.2. the TL6.5 is in its original model. As I mentioned elsewhere, I have been very taken by the 6.5 after I purchased the Ref 3. I purchased Ref 3 before the 6.5 was introduced. Unfortunately I have not had the opportunity of doing a direct comparison this far. Having said that, I have not heard in the 6.5 any of the relative flaws of 'Bluthnerization' of piano sound that I experienced in my auditions of the original 7.5. Were I to consider a new tubed linestage, both the VTL 6.5 and the 7.5 Mk.2 would definitely be in the running.

In wandering about the analog preamp world...mainly due to the fact that the 861 v4, while good...is not a the top of the class in analog reproduction. I listened to a number of preamps in stores...a benefit of travel...and the ARC LS26 and Ref 3, Ayre 5 and VTL 6.5 in my home...driving solid state monoblocks...for me the VTL provided the best balance between the speed/fast settling of the best of SS and the detailed clarity of the mid range without turning the lowend control towards the soft end of the scale...thus for now the 6.5...but I am considering the 7.5mkII, Ayre KX-R...and possibly the new Spectral DMC30SS...so those are my thoughts....bottom line the VTL seems to combine the best of tube...with SS...my only quibel....it would be nice to have ZERO feedback....but on the other I can't point the finger at a problem it causes...

John

salvo: i am wondering if you have had the opportunity at this time to audition any of the preamps on your list? if you are seriious about the ref 3, i would also see about an auditon with the vtl 6.5 if the vtl7.5 mk2 is not in the budget.

guidocorona - your comments noted. wishing you the opportunity to explore the vtl 7.5 mk 2 at length for your comments some day. i know you have done good listening with the vtl 6.5 at your friend's on the east coast.

hikejohn - dont forget to share your opinions and comparisons after ample audions of the high end ayre.vtl/spectral preamps when you have the time. inquiring minds want to know LOL. cheers