Hi-End for Black Metal?

2chnlben,
Couldn't agree with you more. I honestly tried to listen to that estonian band linked here, as well, as many examples of the genre, that my nephew and his friend tried to feed me with- it all sounds utterly the same, low quality of musicianship, lack of musical ideas. Attempt to remain within the boundaries (which are pretty narrow to begin with) of the genre, really hurts the creativity process.
It all sounds forced, artificial and anti- intellectual to me.
The other aspect is the growling of the lead vocalist- is that suppose to convey angst or other strong emotions?
If that's the case, the genre totally failed to employ more subtle and musical ques to do the same, another evidence of the low quality. If your arsenal is growling, high speed guitar playing and lack of any resemblance to melody and rythm, then you're preaching to a very specific type of listener. Being at a few rock shows, I can easily picture the type- majority couln't have care less about the music, it is all about release of emotions in very negative and violent way.
Even my nephew, who listens to nothing else, but metal, said "that's it for me", after attending "Iced Earth" show.
To me, the whole genre has a strong flavor of immaturity, unprofessionalism and lack of musical virtues.
At a risk of making overgeneralized statement, the same goes for rap, as well.
And, BTW, I'm absolutely with Shadorne on AC/DC- recordings and life show- one of the best, I ever attended, minus the crowds.

i am in no way into black metal much more, but as regards musicianship in metsatöll, the key figure behind it is highly qualified musician and a multi-instrumentalist - a student of Veljo Tormis and by his own words a probable successor of his job (you are right about vocal qualities i guess though, but metal bands hardly have huge vocal talents in front). i also hope they will improve with Sony now, but won´t lose their distinctive sound. but i guess it is also a matter of taste and you seem to be in a bit wrong thread. some people hardly thought anything of jazz back in the days. i happen to like hiphop as well (also linked to youth), quite possibly because of some of it´s energy not necessarily because of musicianship.

Waltwalden,
I've made a very general statement, and I'm sure, there are an exceptions. I can't claim I've heard everything out there, but there is a saying to that effect:" One doesn't need to drink the whole ocean to understand it's salty".
Also, there are some good voices in the hard rock/metal- Bruce Dickinson, Dio, James Hetfield come to mind immediately.
Growling- no, thank you very much sir, I'll pass.

Ironmine: I don't heard black metal at all in Axis of Perdition. Sounds like dark ambient to me, more like 'Null', which I like. However I would not put it up there with Schoenberg or Berio! Now that's radical.

03-15-09: Maril555,
I disagree with most of what you say in your thread.
What has the hell has intellect got to do with creating music?

Sheer balderdash.