just starting - mac vs. windows computer source?

Hello all, this decision has been like peeling back layers of an onion.

On the surface, just about anyone can benefit from the flexibility, convenience and "good" sound of computer audio by simply downloading a player, burning their CDs using their existing computer equipment (Mac or Windows) and running their existing laptop or computer through a reasonably priced DAC.

If your goals are to have a bit higher quality, using dedicated audio hardware, it seems a music server is the way to go. Apparently sound quality approaching all but the best CD players can be achieved using hardware like a reasonably priced Mac mini or a dedicated desktop (or even a dedicated laptop) with external storage.

If your system is already very good, it seems the first two levels may not be the end game. In this case, a higher quality Mac mini with SSD and at least 8GB RAM must be considered or a higher level Windows based server such as one of the CAPS models. A suitable Mac mini with USB super drive can be had for about $1,200 and the already constructed CAPS servers I have looked at seem to be about $1,500 for a similar level of performance, including 256GB SSD and Audio Class 2.0 drivers. The CAPS v.3 Carbon offers the benefit of having no fan but the mini would come with more memory 8GB vs. 4GB in the Carbon. I have not yet read any comparisons between the i7 quad processor in the Mac and the processor used in the CAPS Carbon. External storage would add anywhere from about $500 to $1K with either of these options.

I strongly suspect I will need at least this third level to achieve the sound I have from my system now. Therefore, it appears at a minimum I need to plan on $1.5K plus the costs of external storage and a DAC (probably around $3K total) just to jump in at a level where I will be satisfied.

Going forward, there seems to be another whole level to the servers that I cannot find too much information about. On the Mac side, folks like Mojo Audio and Core Audio Technology will provide anything from kit power supply upgrades to whole unit upgrades for prices ranging from about $900 to around $2K. Either Core Audio or Mojo will sell you the whole deal for the ballpark of $3K. On the Windows side, options include the top CAPS v.3 Zuma (about $2,200 with 8GB and 256GB SSD) and/or the addition of the Red Wine Audio Black Lightning power supply (about $1,200 with two battery packs), which can be added to either the Carbon or Zuma. Therefore, to achieve this higher level, I would be investing in the ballpark of $3K, or north, plus the cost of the DAC, plus the cost of external storage, regardless of whether I choose Mac or Windows.

I may be over thinking this, but it is something I prefer to plan once and execute, rather than going the "small steps trial and error" method I used to assemble my system.

Mitch,

Yeap, it was definitely you. My LL2 deluxe is a keeper. Not having a remote will be an issue for many, but it doesn't bother me especially in the context of computer audio and the ability to remotely change volume for those moments someone is speaking to me and need to lower volume temporarily. Did you consider the ML1.2 at the time of upgrading amps?

You've come a long way in just one week or so since your first post. Luckily the discussion here didn't turn into Mac vs. Windows as if it was attacking the very essence of the people involved. I don't find that helpful.

Some thoughts about your post above. Both the Carbon and mini with a gazillion GB RAM will be wonderful. But I tend to think you are thinking too expensive for just trying out. For a dedicated audio server you don't need much processing horsepower, as evidenced in all but the CAPS meant to run DSP, and my own experience with an older laptop with CPU activity below 4% while playing music. Having RAM is good, but 4 GB seems adequate (my laptop has only 1 GB!!!!), so not sure going to 8 GB is a need - but it is cheap, though.

Here's a path for your consideration: get a used mini off eBay and upgrade some parts. Steve Nugent claims the Oct-09 (I think that was the month) was the best sounding mini he has heard, plus they are cheap. Those minis came with an external (switching) power supply, unlike the new ones. Add a SSD, RAM and you are good to go. BTW, do you really need 256 GB SSD? Add a linear power supply later if you like what computer audio is doing for you. Mojo and Core Audio are certainly options, and make sure you read through the feedback - I have seen threads about them, but don't have enough info to have a point of view about them.

Have fun!

Lewinskih01, this research has been a learning experience and the choice is difficult because each system had its advantages and it seems they are equally good sonically, when set-up properly. I don't mind paying a bit more to get the level of server I want up front, but I only want to go through the decision once.

For reasons of compatibility, I would prefer to stay with an all Windows based system but when I compare the server options it seems that a similar level CAPS server is significantly more expensive than even a very good Mac mini and, in addition, the CAPS gear seems to be tweakier with the variety of connections, power, etc. No question, the Zuma with Red Wine PS looks very good but I would be looking at about $3,400 for that combination while I can get, directly from Mac, a brand new mini i7 2.6 GHz quad core with 256GB SSD and 8GB memory for a flat $1,300, which is $900 less than the CAPS Zuma alone, without the Red Wine PS. The Mac is well-supported, can be configured at the factory exactly as I need, and seems to have a wider following.

Regarding power upgrades to the Mac, I have learned power supply improvements yield huge dividends in most audio gear, and everything in my system has an outstanding power supply. Therefore, it does go against my grain to consider that I wouldn't upgrade the stock switch mode supply and fan in the Mac. However, you are correct, the threads about Core Audio and Mojo indicate there are issues. I also don't like the idea of voiding the Mac warranty by changing the power supply. Therefore, I think it may be best to stay away from PS upgrade options, especially since most users apparently find the stock Mac mini PS works just fine, without those upgrades.

Unless I learn something different, as much as I would like to consider a windows server, the Mac mini option seems better for me except for compatibility and power supply issues. If the power supply were such a big deal, I doubt so many with high end systems would use the mini as their digital audio server. I haven't made a final decision but I am leaning toward the Mac.

I love Macs, and use them for everything but my music server. There are different schools on what or why computers, player programs and file types sound different. Although the general consensus is that noise is the primary issue, there appears to be different views as to what noise to deal with- into the computer, out of the computer or within the computer.

You have mentioned CAPS, and that is one option- a low power motherboard that clips along at a steady speed with isolated USB. Another option, and the one I have chosen over time, is the high power pre-processing that then nearly shuts the computer down as the files play using XXHighend as the player program.

FWIW, I wish I could have stayed with Macs, but XXHighend on w7 sounds the best hands down. It takes some work, but it is worth the efforts. I have used every player on Mac and a well respected Linux based appliance server (Auraliti- similar to a CAPS).

I'd have to disagree with computer audiophile on processing power, more is better, reducing potential for jitter, cycle steal interference. The problem is that faster clocked motherboards and CPU's become electrically "noisier" and most builders don't have electrical noise reduction as a priority in a consumer product.