$800 Cartridge Shootout and Upgrade Path

Doug,

Thanks for muddying the waters! Kidding. Actually one of my concerns was that the Teres height adjuster would be a major plus. I am not that proficient with fiddling around with tonearms yet and while I had considered a Basis Vector (with the adjustment option), I just heard so much good stuff about the Schroeder that I felt that perhaps I should make the plunge with that arm. I am less concerned with the cartridge. I feel that I can work up to that after the fact.

Thanks for the info on the motor, that was a concern. I have a friend who lives in Colorado Springs so perhaps a visit with him is in order so that I can go hear both tables since they are both conveniently located in that area. I am less concerned with the arm situation since I'm blowing the bank with just this table and arm.

Not that these tables are cheap but it does seem that at their price point that they are SOA solutions that compete with the best.

I wonder how many of us would have to donate to get Dan_ed the Galibier for the three-way shoot-out......

I’m back from shopping at Holister, Co. and Abercrombie and Fitch. My daughter made out like a bandit: over two hundred dollars in ten minutes, half of which she paid! Not bad I say. And she is so happy about her new winter coat. (There is life, I guess, outside of vinyl, but I know it’s hard to believe, right?)

Letch,

Thanks for the kind words; I, too, appreciate your posting here. Your comments are always welcome.

Your choice between the Quattro Alu and Teres 265 will be a tough one, for there’re both fine turntables. I believe the October edition of Stereophile is carrying an article, written by Art Dudley, about the Quattro Alu. I only skimmed the text. I hate to admit that I spent more time drooling over the pictures.

I once had a suspended turntable, but it wasn’t in the same league as the Basis 2001 by any means. However, I did find it very musical, rich, and warm. In those days, you know when the covered wagons made their way west, I had no idea what PRaT meant, and I only discovered the definition for that acronym recently, I hate to admit. But the type of music I like is not full of fury or bombast; it is lyrical, smooth, and melodic. Later I purchased a direct-drive turntable on the basis of a review by Julian Hirsch. Boy did it every sound crummy, but I really didn’t know any better until now, thanks to Twl, Dougdeacon, 4yanx, and others.

In regards to the Nottingham Spacedeck, Luda, my wife, likes it the best of the ones I have shown her, including the Michell Gyro and the Teres 245. She likes the more traditional look of the Linn.

>>I wouldn't say shallow, I prefer to think I'm sophisticated in that way but it wouldn't be the first time I was fooling myself.<<

I would probably be the last one to call another one shallow, but since I like my equipment to look good, I feel a little guilty because the “really hardcore” audiophiles seem to be focused on the sound; aesthetics seem to be secondary. Well they are not secondary to me. Maybe that’s one reason I could never warm up to equipment like NAD despite the following it has gathered over the years.

I don’t take too seriously comments by others claiming to have Teres-killing decks. How would they know without hearing a friend’s unit or buying one for themselves to compare to their “world-beater?” As for Stereophile, I have mixed feelings. I agree: how can they lump so many turntables into one category? Well, the answer is that they try to compare various units on the basis of memory, whim, bias, personal relations with the manufacturer (e.g., the love-fest with Musical Fidelity), and, of course, advertising dollars. (Yeah, what’s up with putting the Graham Robin on the Gailibier? Oh that makes a lot of sense? Maybe Art should have tried something else, or better yet he should have asked the manufacturer for an appropriate arm and phono cartridge.)

If you need more information about the Schroeder Model 1, you may need to talk with Twl. You will have to examine that arm’s effective mass and its bearing assembly to determine whether it will properly accommodate your desired cartridge. Given you musical tastes, you could start with a Shelter 501, and from there you could try different cartridges. Here’s some data about the Model 1 that you might find useful:

1) Torsion-bearing, magnetically stabilized and damped

2) Virtually no bearing friction, no bearing chatter

3) Dynamic damping of the tonearm-cartridge-resonance through induction of eddy currents, adjustable

4) VTA repeatable and finely adjustable

5) Tonearm wands are interchangeable, available in 8.5 – 12inch length

6) Effective Mass depending on the armwand from 5gr – 35gr

7) Tonearm wands/rods made out of carbon fiber, jacaranda, ebony, acacia, bamboo, pertinax etc.

8) Incognito wiring, single run, other wiring upon request.

http://www.soundscapehifi.com/schroder.htm#model1

With different armwand material and armwand weights to choose from, you should, at least in theory, be able to match the Model 1 to virtually any cartridge. But I don’t know about the cabling or the bearing assembly of the tonearm being able to absorb the energy of a low compliance cartridge, like a Shelter. Once again, you will need to ask Twl.

Thanks Artar1! I'm getting a lot out of dovetailing my questions into this thread.

Twl - Perhaps you could comment more on the Schroeder, I haven't seen much information on what can be accomplished with the various materials for the tonearm. I like the idea of a Shelter 501. And is this arm suitable for someone who is just learning about tonearms? I'm not really a tweaker in that regard. Though I want to learn more.

Any comments about Schroeder in general would be helpful from those with experience hearing one. The data on audioasylum is very positive but not too specific on details.

The Schroeder does have an excellent rep and both companies offer it as package deals with their tables. I'm still wavering on the aesthetics of the tables though. It's a nice choice though. It seems to me that there is plenty of aesthetically pleasing equipment out there so someone cares about those things.

Regarding the Schroeder, it is out of my price range, so I have never used it. I know several people(including Chris Brady of Teres) who used a Schroeder with a Crown Jewel(which is actually a re-named Shelter 501) and liked the combination.
Heavy armwand should be used.

Wow, this thread has come along way from a discussion about an $800 cartridge upgrade to talks about high-end tables and arms! No complaints here, I learn a great deal from threads such as this.

On the subject of shopping trips. My wife spent Saturday at a charity flee market that supports a day program for special needs adults. So she comes home with 3 records! Ok, so two of them were duplicates for me but it really is the thought that counts. This is just another indication to me that she is supporting my audio passion. I may have to start being nicer to her.

In the short two years of my analog rebirth I have discovered that with almost any of the modern tables that I can enjoy just about any type of music. I now listen to nearly everything from Bluegrass to Bach, though classic rock is my base, and I felt that even my former Music Hall did a good job on all of this music. I have learned that dynamics are probably most important when you consider music that might be described as rich and warm. The playback of so many musical passages are enhanced by the ability to provide that immediate tone and beat. You may not notice any deficiency with rock but you most certainly will with classical and even some Bluegrass. Things my old Dual table way back when could not deliver.

So maybe I am just reiterating what Twl has already stated, that you really can't go wrong with any of the better modern tables. If you can accept this then why shouldn't aesthetics come into the equation. We are visual creatures and will probably spend a good deal of time looking at our equipment while we are listening to it.