I agree they just do not know WHAT to measure.Science and technology do not have the answers to plenty of questions.
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Isn't it amazing how another cable thread can start all the same stuff going?I wonder if it is endemic to audiophiles? Or is it all Human Males?(If car engine oil quality, brand, and viscosity threads are inspected, it becomes clear it is Human Male condition, and not just audiophiles)
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I just changed the oil on my car (yes myself) and my main stereo sounds MUCH BETTER!!!If you need to know: Ford Focus ST with Recaro seats, 252 hp, over 150mph top speed six speed manual transmission.. and if I stay off the boost, 32 to 33pg highway.
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The entire World up to Humans was survival of the fittest.
Humans, particularly Christians, have decided to save the unfit, so they can reproduce the most, and the well off and fittest, seem to have pretty much stopped reproducing. So if you want to help this cause, please send your money to the starving so they can make more starving babies!! You have been really successful at this since the 1950s when all the save the starving started. And the save them from diseases too. You do know AIDS was caused by all the reuse of needles inoculating the entire African continent for other diseases. The preaids virus, which was only in a few folks who ate bushmeat, got totally spread throughout the population, by the reuse of needles for innoculations. One needle would innoculate tens of thousands and that blending over and over helped pre HIV to become capable of Human to Human transmission. All in a good cause. I on the other hand spend my money where it does me the most good. On my stereo. Plus I have not spread any diseases other than the common cold, honestly.
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Sorry my comments were utterly off topic. I suggest trying Wikipedia for more info on topic mentioned.
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Sometimes it is good to just ignore it all.
Sure I could spend thousands on some better powercords than the Pangea I have now.
But I ask my self:
Do I need the better powercords and better sound?
What if I don’t like the sound after spending $1500 a pop on some wire? I did like the improvement after spending $$$ on interconnects.. Why do I balk at big ticket powercords??? I would call this problem my Rubicon... And I ain’t crossing the line.
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I love my Ford Focus ST. I have thought about the RS.. but I am just a little too cheap to fork over the dough for a RS. (Plus I love my mpgs, over 32mpg average, if I stay off the boost)
I spent $30K for the ST ($33list) and the price of the RS (over 44K) is more than I want (really, can afford) to spend. (If I had the money.. if only!)
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"Cannot serve two masters" I guess that means you have a one track mind?
IMO the greatest minds are those which CAN carry opposing views and work with them together. the synergy is often the way forward. Folks who have monolithic notions end up stuck on a dead end.
(That will be $200 for my thirty second therapy session, Geoff.)
PS I just made a 4 meter AC cord out of Carol 12 gauge and some Marinco AC ends laying around for ten years. Folks bothered me claiming Pangea cords SUCKKKK. So I decided to try a basic cord to compare, just for the Hell of it. Before I go spend $$$ on other 'better' (than Pangea) power cords.
Plugged in the unbroken-in cord just ten minutes ago. Sounds like music. (I will let it break in for a week before making any further pronouncements.)
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After several hours of listening to my cheap AC cord. (Marinco ends, $12.99 or so each. And Carol 12/3 wire 13 ft cost like $13.No problems with the sound. Just as nice as it was before. (Actually slightly warmer presentation.)
I suppose if I actually did a serious comparison I could nit pick my way into defending spending $350 for the Pangea powercord (4 meter AC9SE)Mainly I am trying to decide if blowing a grand on a powercord could be rationalized.. LOL (So far, no way.)I may just buy some OFC wire to compare that too?Cheapest bulk OFC powercord 12 gauge is like $100 for 13 ft.
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OK after a few hours went back to the Pangea.Well hot damn, the Pangea sounds better. Just more musical. Solves that problem I really did not have.
As for the Hurricane. I do not want to spend $11,000 to buy one 3 meter powercord, only to have it still be a meter short. Maybe I could special order a 4 meter Hurricane. for like $15000?
I think my powercords are gonna have to be good enough as is. But I thought about it. and tried some. (though clearly the new PC had no break in time. so...... Who cares. yawn. |
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""
that entry level or mediocre equipment is not sufficient for enjoying music.
""
An odd statement by a true snobbish audiophile.
I totally disagree. However there are other audiophiles who do agree with you.
In my opinion Audiogon is for anyone who wants better sounding music. Whether that is from a beginner system, or seven figures.
If devilboy would click on any area of sales, and choose price, it can start high or low. Click so it starts 'low'. Notice ALL those low prices. usually starting around a hundred, and gradually moving up to tens of thousands.
Those low hundred dollar things sell too!!! You just do not bother to look at them I guess.
I buy stuff all over the map. $40 five disc CD changers off eBay, $7000 SACD players.
Price sometimes has little to do with how good some things are.
And music can sound great from plenty of cheap sources. (as many musicians use, though their whole life is about music.)
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Twice now you have been given to fact that a lot of what sells on Audiogon is in fact not expensive.After I wrote that your response is still:""
The whole purpose of Audiogon is to sell high-end audio equipment to
people who feel they need high-end audio equipment to fully enjoy their
music.""Which as I and another have shown (if you bother to look at prices)And I left off the start "
"EVERYTHING about Audiogon is centered around the idea..."
OK maybe I should have kept that part too.But I certainly disagree, and so does nonoise.
I just have to say Audiogon sells all sorts of equipment. Low priced and high priced. And since for many years Audiogon has been the #1 place for selling and buying gear. lots of all kinds, cheap and uber costly get listed here. But even the cheap stuff is the audiophile sort.Which speaks volumes for folks who come here.
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To venture into another close at hand can of worms to "Can cables make a hearable difference" is the other can of worms related to it. Which is: Is the difference WORTH THE MONEY SPENT?
That is a dilemma I ponder yes I spent over a thousand on power cords already. (each $39 to $349) and like them. BUT, would spending $3199 on just one powercord (A four meter AQ Hurricane) be reasonable for me?
(I have spent $3,199 on one pair of interconnects.A pair of Kimber KS1116 seven meters for the pre to amp. so it is not totally insane to consider.)
$3200 is a lot of worms. that is half the cost of a new Bryston 4B3. or 1/4 the cost of a pair of 7B3s. Which I know could make me happy.
See Geoff, you started this Hurricane business. So I am actually thinking about it. But the major problem is I doubt I would feel I got $3200 in VALUE from the cord. |
Just to mention there is no free ride at "The Cable Company". To ’borrow’ a cable you pay for it. Then if you do not like it, you can use your money already paid to borrow other cables after you return the one you had. (naturally more cost means you pay that extra) You NEVER get a refund. So eventually you will be buying something from them, or have a big credit with them! Just no refund. if you are really serious about buying new cables, and want to use the service, it really is good. If you are just fooling around, go elsewhere.
Audio Advisor has an actual refund. but use a refund more than twice with Audio Advisor and you will be banned.
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OK I am wrong about The Cable Company policy.
I admit it.
I now have to burn my "Infallible Guru" card, and turn in my badge.
As long as I am confessing serious shortcomings.. I confess I really like Yoko Ono albums. And enjoy listening to her sing. Some of her songs are great!. Now I have to burn my "audiophile" card too.
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mbishop63: "" One thing I’ve found about interconnect cables is you have to be patient through the "break in period" ""
And then there are cable that suck.. period. I bought a cable that was really no good for what it was intended for. The dealers says let it break in. a month and I finally just said enough is enough! and returned it. the pressure to ’go along’ with break in was high. (this was the cable location I finally went and bought a $3200 IC for. and got something worth the money that sounded good)
So sometimes you know it is crap. Oddly other cables the first time I heard it I was 'this is garbage, I am going to return it!." but in a few days to came around. Never know.
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""
Might the "Break-in" effect be in ones head? ;-)
""?Sure, for some folks it may be. I am not all people. I cannot actually say it is for anyone. But for the sake of this discussion, I would bet for at least a few folks, yeah, in their head.
But having had plenty of experience if returning stuff which never got any better, vs stuff that delightfully improved..I would say that 'in MY head' is not the case.Naturally for folks whose dogma precludes cables sounding different, they would dismiss my comment out of hand, as It does not fit their notions.
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The amazing thing I find is some folks think their wisecracks and insults, or carefully constructed arguments... make a dent in anyone’s beliefs. On EITHER side. They do not. All the written drivel has not changed one person’s notions. Not one. The many YEARS of written threads just like this one thousands of threads, probably millions of words typed...
The ONLY thing I have read, or heard changing anyone’s mind, had been when a ’non-believer’ finally maybe even accidentally, hears a wire, cable or cord that they themselves can easily hear a difference. Then they see the light, and finally accept that wires cords cables might sound different. That is the only way. I know of no one who has drifted from believing in cords and such having differences, to the side all wires are the same if the electrical parameters are the same. Not one. But from non believers to believers? plenty, including myself.
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sorry I had to remove my evil evil post.
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Nothing to see.... Move along...
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"Cuttlefish will one day rule the Earth."
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Back in the 80's I used some home made with OFC Mark Levinson wire ($2 a ft) and Radio Shack gold plated RCA. Used those for years. Then replaced the RCA with Vampire 'Tiffany' style RCA. Had a few others like a Kimber PBJ, KImber Hero. Some used KCAG Kimber. Finally I upgraded to Cardas Parsec and liked them except the 7 meter just did not work out. Went big a few yeas ago to Kimber KS1116 for that 7 meter run, Then Kimber KS1016 all around. Much better. I still use the Parsec here and there, it is nice wire too.
My take on wire is you have to have a level of quality of equipment to be able to hear the better wire. Only when I went from average $1000 a pop to $5000 a pop equipment then I could really hear the cables more. Before than there was a little I could hear, but hard to hear differences.
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I have switched my wires ’willy-nilly’ and the results were not good. Nothing worked. When i actually stuck the wires where they can actually GO and everything works..HOT DAMN everything worked. Lucky many wires have actual connectors which prevent one from creating hazards..
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