music , mind , thought and emotion


There is not a society on this planet, nor probably ever has been, which is without some form of musical expression, often closely linked with rythm and dance. My question is less concentrated on the latter two however.
What I am pondering boils down to:
What is music and what does it do to us
Why do we differentiate music from random noise so clearly and yet can pick up certain samples within that noise as musical.
By listening to music, we find some perhaps interesting, some which we would call musical. What differentiates "musical music" from "ordinary music" and this again from "noise"?
In a more general sense again:
If music has impact on us, what is the nature of our receptors for it. Or better: Who, what are we, that music can do to us what it does?
What would be the nature of a system, which practically all of us would agree upon, that it imparts musicality best?
And finally, if such a sytem would exist, can this quality be measured?
detlof
Ohn: when I said "you" or "your" I didn't mean you personally; just a foil, of which i thank you in advance for your indulgence.
Oh, how painful, one on top of the mountain; nowhere to go but down. Can't walk down because, one's back to square one. Can't jump down because it means an end to live, path, all that times and knowledges are wasted. The only way is to jump up. But where? The door is right in front, yet far away; far away yet, like right at the nose. I'd felt the pain/beauty. :-). I also felt. ;-).

When the mind (internal) rises, everything (external) rises; when everything (external) rises, the mind (internal) rises. When the mind falls, everything falls; when everything falls, the mind falls. When is it end? When is this dualism end? And How?

Twl, "Koan" = "koh'an/ n" is a Chinese pronounciation, but it means "to ponder".

It's Friday, time to jam people.
6ch: is the flag moving, or the mind watching it?

If neither, what is move-ing?

If both, what is move-ing?

How many paths are there up the mountain?

If infinite, what is one's point of reference to say "path"? Where is the center?

The Zen you have on the top of the moutain is the Zen you brought up. If you are attached to the "top", or "thought" or "matter", however, sometimes you don't see this...

If don't see this, what are "you" seeing?

If see this, what are you *seeing*?

The wild geese do not intend to cast
their reflection
The water has no mind to receive their images.
Asa, your above thoughts about mind (consciousness) and matter ("real"world) seem to me highly Jaynseian, hence only once removed Jungian and I could not agree more. (Sorry, generally it seems to please you less, when you are agreed with (-; )Greetings from South Africa this once,
Hi detlof.

I've never read Jaynes. What does he say?

Agree is fine, hello, but order arises from chaos. Stir pot, then, is good too. I didn't make the "rules"...

Hope you are well.

Mark