whitecamaross,
I am going to take your good advice and demo a Pass X150.8. I emailed Pass Labs and they directed me to Mark @ Reno HiFi for an in home demo. I know your views on the X250.8 and the X350.8 but do you have any experience with the X150.8? Anyone's input on the X150.8 would be appreciated. Thanks, Ron |
jafant, whitecamaross & thezaks,
Whoops I guess I misread whitecamaross' statement.... "
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!" ... I now understand his statement was made prior to any evaluation of the X350.8.... Thank you all for your help and discussions on these fine amps. I can't wait to demo one in my home with my equipment. I will post my impressions. Ron |
This amp thread just got too big league for me! |
Not going anywhere...I just get more excited reading about equipment I can afford. |
@mkwglyg Huh? I think you need to re-read it. |
So why move them so fast? What's next? |
The Boulder 2060..... Oh no what about your back! |
I bought an amp from WCSS a while back and we have talked and emailed dozens of times. A few months ago when he was thinking of starting a youtube channel he ask me what I would like to see as far as him reviewing amps. I told him (and it applies here too) that I would like to see a more consistent review and keep the same components in the system, ie... same source, 2 different sounding preamps, 2 sets of speakers (maybe an electrostatic and typical dynamic loudspeaker) same cables etc... I also said I would like to see him throw in a budget amp and a tube amp once and a while. Also take more time to review amps...like a month. Do more of a thorough review and explain in detail how the amp sounded with a tubed preamp vs a SS preamp, what speaker the amp liked more, power, heat, does it sound good at all levels etc..... Well he completely ignored me! But that’s OK because it’s his thread and he’s doing it the way he wants to. Lately it seems like he’s been going through gear like a rich kid spending daddies money... lol. But again it’s his thread and that’s the way he’s gonna do it. If you don’t like it don’t read it. |
WCSS at 6'1" and 270 lbs I think YOU are too big for your room! |
Maybe you should change your name from whitecamaross to BigYukonXL |
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I disagree..... "Louder = Better"
Once you damage your hearing permanently the contest is over! |
I use the DSP EQ in Roon to tame a 40hz bass peak along with ASC tube traps in my room. It is very transparent and doesn't seem to have any negative effects. |
Hey Happy Birthday WCSS! now....what to get a guy who has everything |
WCSS It's been my experience that using room correction because the speaker is too BIG for your room will be an uphill battle. I would recommend looking for a high quality smaller speaker. With your top tier electronics and a smallish room I think you will get the best SQ by matching the speaker to the room.... I use Roon's EQ to tame a 8db peak in the bass in my room because I have no choice but to place one of my speakers fairly close to a corner and because the speakers I have are ported through the bottom of the cabinet. I am now looking for a sealed cabinet designed speaker with the hopes I won't have to use any room correction. |
@grey9hound I use Roon's EQ. It allows you to manually EQ the frequency, Q and amount of attenuation. I have tried Audyssey (with my HT setup) but it is an automatic system which I hated. I only want to address the 1 or 2 frequencies (below 200hz) that my situation produces. I have heard nothing but good things about the Lyngdorf RoomPerfect system and I'm sure it sounds great but in my system I wanted to do as little to the signal as possible. I also wanted to keep the boxes and cables to a minimum.
@WCSS I think the Magico S5 mk2 is a better choice (for your room) and can't wait to hear what you think of them....maybe when you are done with them you can send them my way! |
whitecamaross,
I am very happy with my new amp purchase (thanks to you and your very informative forum posts). This year I’m planning on upgrading my source. Have you had the chance to compare the Lumin to the PS Audio to the Sim 650D (if you still have it)? Thanks, Ron
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I think this shootout will be decided on speaker design. The Magicos being a sealed design cabinet should integrate better in a small room. |
@ riaa_award_collectors_on_facebook.... no but WCSS could create a Virtual System on Agon that would show his room and his current set-up which would be kinda cool |
whitecamaross,
Do you still have the Sim 740p to try with the 860a? Curious to know how that pair sounds with your Salon 2's or the PL 500's.
That combo with a really good single malt scotch whiskey is all you need! |
I have been keeping up with this thread almost since it's inception. There are not many places you can get an unbiased review of so many different types and brands of audio equipment on a weekly basis from the same reviewer! I have been looking to upgrade my amp for quite a while but have found it impossible to find a dealer who has the amps I'm interested in, much less my speakers to play them through. I had 4 amps I was interested in and thought would mate well with my system, room and musical tastes. I only found 1 dealer who would ship me (at my cost if I didn't purchase the amp) one of the amps I was interested in for an in home demo..... I finally decided to PM whitecamaross and ask for his advice. I (in detail) described my system, room, musical tastes, listening levels and what I would like to improve on over my current amp. I gave him my list of amps I was interested in (all of which he has reviewed in his system). After talking (email and phone) with him MANY times he told me because I listen at low volume levels, the amps I thought would sound good in my home would have to be turned up loud to sound their best. He suggested the Plinius SB-301 mk2 for my application. He had recently had that amp in his system, loved it and was ready to sell it. BTW he had a couple of the other amps I was interested in but didn't think they would be a good match for my needs.....I ended up purchasing the Plinius from him and couldn't be happier. It is clean, powerful, detailed and has control in the bass that I didn't think was possible with my speakers, and all at low to moderate listening levels.... Exactly what I wanted! Thanks whitecamaross for your help and advice.
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@techno_dud Very supportive of you.....nice job. |
So is this thread going to morph into "My Long List of Cables and My Personal Review of Each!" ? |
This used to be my favorite thread....now I quickly scroll through it. |
I think the black system would be great for evaluating speakers but you are reviewing amps so I say keep the Ref 10 and a couple different types of speakers and review amps. I like the idea that maplegrovemusic had of throwing in a lesser priced amp now and again...that would be very informative for audiophiles on a budget. Also I know this is a solid state amp thread but to review a tube amp now and then would but fun to hear how they compare to the solid state amps you reviewed.
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I have read the entire thread....I’m just saying every 10-15 solid state amps reviewed throw in a tube amp. |
@whitecamaross ...My Simaudio 870a sounds wonderful at low volumes, didn't the 860a you just sold also perform well at low levels?
I'd like to hear from the lucky Agoner who purchased it. How it is working in the system they have. |
I remember when this thread was really fun....now it's turned kinda vicious. |
@whitecamaross I think you have been informative, honest, creative and a fun read for 2 + years and it's not your fault that some people don't know how to control themselves. |
whitecamaross, I have thoroughly enjoyed reading all of your detailed amp reviews. I have a Classe CA-5100 paired with Proac D30R's (89 sensitivity and 8 ohms) easy to drive speakers. I listen (75% 2 channel music and 25% HT). I'm looking to upgrade my 2 channel music listening by purchasing a 2 channel amp for my Proac's and keeping the 5100 for center and surrounds. I have done a lot of reading on the Pass X150.8, X250.8 and the Classe CA-2200. I think the Pass amps might run a little too hot for my application plus size and warm up time I have heard my also be an issue. I love the sound of my 5100 but would like to improve on it if possible. Your thoughts on the CA-2200 would be much appreciated. Thank you, Ron |
@whitecamaross I remember a while back you mentioning not to mix class A or A/B amps with class D amps in a HT setup so I called Classe Audio and spoke to a tech about it. He told me it would not be a problem in any way (timing/speed), in fact he said they do it all the time. I use a Simaudio 870a (class A/B) amp for my front L&R speakers and a Classe Amp 5 (class D) amp for center and surrounds and it sounds great....no timing/speed issues at all. |
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lol...that sounds about right. Maybe that's why they had so many issues and had to be bought out.
So have you ever experimented mixing the 2 classes of amps in a HT setting? I first had a Classe CA 5100 (class A/B) amp driving my center and surround channels then switched to their Amp 5 (class D) amp and couldn't tell much difference. When used as a music amp (powering the front L & R channels) there was a big difference (the CA 5100 sounded way better) but for center and surround channels the Amp 5 integrates nicely with my Sim 870a. |
How about getting the Canadians in the mix with their 870a / 740p combo? |
Hey WCSS someone is looking for you on a new thread.
Enthusiast Audiophile Writer wanted
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So it took 2 Hegel H 30's (15k each) to best the Bel Canto Black system....I wonder how 2 Simaudio 860a's (15k each) would fair? |
What about the Sim Moon 880M's? |
Politicians and Women? To the best of my knowledge there are no women involved in this thread....well....until tomorrow |
Yeah I could see that one coming a mile away! |
@WCSS
I think I’ll hold on to my Sim 870a for a while longer. Just bought a pair of YG’s that sound wonderful with it. BTW how many times in the last year did you email me asking to either buy or trade for my amp? |
@ WCSS
I went from a Proac D30r to a YG Carmel 2. I felt I was getting too much speaker/room interaction from the floor ported Proac design. After reading your review of your Magico's I started looking at sealed cabinet designs. Magico and YG became my short list. The Carmel 2's are a little lean where my room produces too much bass (36-42hz). For me in my room with my electronics and musical tastes they are a perfect fit. Very detailed, highly refined and a massive soundstage. I think speaker/room interaction shot to the top of my list of importance for hi-end 2 channel listening. The Carmel 2's would be too small for you but the Hailey or the Sonja might work....for a few months.....lol.
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@viper6
In your 11/7 post you stated "Ported designs try to get more bass by having the port blow the air to the back wall for reinforcement, but one poster here says he hates ported designs."
Which poster are you referring to? |
@ viber6
ron17,
I forgot the name of the poster who hates ports, but it was a few days and a few pages ago.
I checked a few days and a few pages ago and can't seem to find (as you stated) the poster on this thread who hates ports.
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@WCSS
Maybe you shouldn't post anymore first impressions....Some people get too worked up over them! lol |
@WCSS
My last 3 pairs of speakers were a ported design and because of room/placement constraints I've struggled with too much bass in the (36-42hz) region. I sold my Aurender music server and bought an Innuos Zenith mk2 SE so I could use Roon and the parametric EQ portion of Roon's DSP Engine. That worked fine but I really don't like having to use EQ in a 2 channel system (great for HT though). So I started searching for a speaker that would be a better fit for my room. When you wrote about your Magico's and your impressions of them I thought the sealed cab design and lack of low bass would be a better fit for me and my room. I found a great deal on the YG Carmel 2's (the smallest floorstander YG makes) which are 1, a sealed cab design and 2, flat down to 50hz, -5db @ 40hz and -10db @30hz. The YG's were lean in the exact areas my room produced too much bass .... a perfect fit for my room. I now have better tighter more defined bass and don't have to use EQ anymore. I find the YG's very detailed, highly refined and imaging and soundstage are crazy good (way better than my prior speakers).....One of my closest friends owns a hi-end audio store so I asked him to help me set-up the YG's. We spent 3 hours listening and moving them until they were nowhere near where I had them set-up. It pays to have a pro (especially with speakers) help with set-up. He wants me to listen for a couple of weeks before he comes back for a fine tuning......For me (so far) the best jump in SQ has been finding the best speaker for my room and musical tastes. I will probably be adjusting and tweaking cables etc... for the next few months...will update later.
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@WCSS If you use Roon with your music server it comes with EQ within their DSP engine. It's free, transparent, easy to use and all in the digital domain.....No need for a stand alone EQ. |
@WCSS No not with the YG’s but I used it with the Proac’s I had. With the Proac’s I attenuated by 8db @ 36 & 42hz which gave me a flatter response in the bottom end. In my experience I have found it’s best to use EQ as a last resort and sparingly. Set-up the speakers to get the best overall frequency response, soundstage, imaging etc... then use EQ as little as possible. Using the EQ in Roon requires you to measure your room first to see where the peaks are so you know where to set the filters, how much to attenuate and how wide to set the Q. I’m still getting use to the YG’s and might use Roon’s EQ with them in the future but I won’t have to use as much as I did with my Proac’s. |
@spinaker01 Great article on Roon by The Absolute Sound http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/a-roon-primer/Its interactive abilities, great sound and the ability to use EQ if you need it makes it a must have for me. I’m hoping it will work with the new music streaming service about to debut in the US (hopefully next month) called Qobuz. Similar to Tidal but with more Hi-Rez (24/96 & 24/192) files to choose from..they say over 2 million Hi-Rez titles! With a better jazz and classical selection than Tidal. |
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@ WCSS
The Plinius SA 103 is rated @ 125 watts per channel in both class A and class AB mode. I know pure class A is a different animal but I thought you were looking for more power not less. The Plinius SB 301 mk2 that I bought from you a while back would have been nice to try with the Neoliths. Is your plan to try and pick up a 2nd SA 103 and run them in mono? |
@WCSS
I think finding a professional to come in and measure, set-up and possibly add some room treatments would get you closer to great sound for your current and future systems.
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