My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!


So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:

Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005

With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:

ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)

NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)

Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)

rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)

cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)

parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)

lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)

McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.

butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)

pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.

classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)

Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:



PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass. It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.

That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!


whitecamaross

Showing 50 responses by techno_dude

Wc, maybe you need to try something better than both the Lumin and the Dave.
I have a feeling this would spank the A1 cute little butt:


http://aplhifi.com/products/digital/dsd-sr/


Wc, as good as the Lumin S1 is , it is still based on Sabre 9018 chip...wich is very good but in my experience is beaten by top dacs out there.

The reason I gave you the APL DSd-SR hint, is because that dac has been compared to DCS Vivaldi, MSB select, Ayon S5, and it was clear the APL was the better dac...more analog...the nearest sound to vinyl. So I can be pretty  sure it will best your S1 and the Dave.

First setup wins imho. Second setup weakest link is DS dac.

Plus you got Luxman synergy going on between DA08 dac and C900u pre, which were voiced to be paired together.

I smell a Gryphon power amp. coming in...

Or maybe 2 x Luxman M-900u in mono configuration.

Hmmm, maybe a Boulder power amp.

Hmmm, Luxman (or Gryphon) and Benchmark should not be allowed to be put in the same sentence on this amplifier thread.

JNITSL

just not in the same league

WC you saw the light! Welcome to the world of the best digital to analog conversion. Told you some posts ago that your Lumin and DS were not sota...

Your newly acquired K1 uses top AKM chips in parallel. Who perfected that design for Esoteric some years ago? Alex Paychev. The owner of APL hi fi , maker of the dac I own ...the DSD-S.

These dacs give, among some others, the most vinyl like analog sound on market today. They reproduce more sonic nuances and an overall more organic presentation. Enjoy!
Luxman ( founded in 1925) was making integrated when Gryphon wasn't even born. Luxman has expertise every audio company would only dream off. 
Luxman M900u amplifier has midrange to die for, it is meaty, tuby, has texture...the highs have tonal density and lots of resolution. Many audiophiles sold their tube big rig to replace it by that amp.
I don’t think his taste is to the very warm side. Like me, he likes to listen loud and my experience is you cannot listen loud when your system or speakers are aiming just a tad on the bright side...even sometimes on the neutral side makes listening at loud  level for long period of times very fatiguing. Specially if you like brass like trumpet, or alto saxophone played loudly.
Maybe that’s what happens when you realize 2 monos amps don’t really sound better than 1 stereo amp in your system. Or it ´s just obsessive compulsive disorder, I know I have it also.

Very nice review indeed.

Like shadorne, I think maybe you should try something like a pair of Sopra 3. My feeling is they would make you ear more of the recording ( sonic nuances, resolution).

WC , if it were me I would not get the Scala Evos. The Sopras 3 have the same new Focal midrange and the same tweeter. I would save 20k.
Can t wait to read about the Krell vs the new generations. 

About the new Paradigm Persona speakers ( the passive ones) , I was curious and went to read about them a bit. Sure impressing is the technology used on the Beryllium midrange, did you see that double magnet ! 

I would like to try a pair on my system. 
I am not tired of reading him. Sure he has his ways, but he can do whatever he wants, it is his money and we can’t judge him. Some audiophiles are very slow movers, some are very fast movers. The rest are in between. The thread tells a lot more than the online magazine reviews that are always positive on most products...

I and the majority of us following this thread want to continue reading his feedback, even if it has flaws sometimes...the op is human he is not perfect like everybody else. Life is short, and it is much better with a thread like that than without...


I would get the Alexia or Scala EVO instead of the ML. You already tried ML if I remember, and you seem to aim for the Wilson type of speaker dynamics.

The baddest systems I’ve seen were with big rig Wilson, or top of the line B&W or Focal.

WC, there is a pair of Verity Audio Lohengrin IIS on audiogon that appeared yesterday. Its 110k msrp speakers. Those could be your final speakers, they sure  would give the spank to the Sashas...


The new solid state preamp C52 is the beginning of a new story for McIntosh. It really can compete with the best pres out there.

I’ ve never tried their amps, but I sure the big stuff is not so far away from Pass and Simaudio. Luxman is another story.
Ayre and Audio Research premps are overpriced big time for what they are. Luxman C-900u spank their big gun pres , for half the $.

If Mac was really mid fi, it absolutely would not have the resale value it has...
I’ m with WC on this.

Audiophiles with experience know this, power is not refinement.

As good as the 700cx will ever be, it is a 1988 Ferrari Countach.
Luxman 900u is a 2018 Ferrari Portofino.
Technology evolution is the key word here.

audiolabirinth is suggesting change the pistons and retrofit a NOS kit on the car. Won’t transform it into the Portofino 2018.

As for the 509x, as good as this integrated is it was build to a price point ( amp section like the M700u )

M900u and its preamp brother were build with Luxman best parts and technology... not the same at all. Like a women wich you fall in love with her body...509x. The other women you fall in love with her body, and her soul too...M900u...you get the whole complete package that transcends the experience.
A dedicated circuit with nice 14 ga is more than enough for me. Would 12 ga change the sound for the better, absolutely not in my case...I don’t care for a little bit more bass...I already got more than I need with the 14 ga wired on a second distribution panel. 

Using Oyaide R1 outlet and loving it also.
audiolabyrinth, liking vintage gear and believing it is on par with todays sota is an illusion most readers of this thread have already acknowledged... may it be digital or amplification or pre amplification.This is the reason they come here and read WC to get to know what has come to be the best by todays modern standards.

You are free to start your own in the vintage section.
Please give us, or this thread a break... You are like someone from a car forum that keeps saying his 3 th gen is better than the 9 th gen. Nobody in the 9 th gen. section takes you seriously.

But sometimes, only sometimes, someone like WC wants to know and ear what the fuzz was all about the 3 th gen. then. But deepdown he already knows the results in advance, he just needs to experience it...to demystify  the myth. To confirm his assumption.
Your modified Krell 700cx is what I would can an audiophile abomination. As good as it will ever be, it will never be pure and will have lost resale value due to modifying... this is always a fact you can t deny.

This thread was always about modern solid state amplifiers. If you guys cannot live with the fact we are testing and discussing the latest and the best here, you can go discuss and compare your older gear ( sooner than later they will need replacement parts) all you want in the vintage section.
Can’t wait for your report !

No way this thing will beat the Lux, or even less detrone the Rowland 925s.
If it is neutral, you will ear your preamp through it , but will not add magic like the big guns.

Just to be clear when the report will be given, I pray to God that our little tweak friends will not go full excuses...
...hum you have to let it heat up for 36 hrs
you need a better power cable or circuit
you need to have the caps replaced
you need to have it stand on a 20 kg beryllium shelve
Nice WC ! A very deadly system without doubt.

And the overweight krell dino  is already accumulating the dust ? Lol
So basically what you are saying is the 700cx is as good as Pass 350.8 and Simaudio 860A... So we can all save 15k by getting the former instead  of the latter s...
Wilson Sasha 2 vs Vivid a G1.

A very interesting duel between two audio heavy contenders. 
Cant’t wait to read your results.
WC , no they won’t be missed. Usually the  gear you miss you buy again... time will tell the truth about those 3 pieces.
Vivid birthday
Vivid birthday
Come and make my day

Vivid bithday
Vivid birthday
Resale could be nightmarey

Vivid birthday
Vivid birthday
Can’t wait to read your meh
I find old recordings like
Saxophone Colossus ( Sony Rollins)
Time out ( Brubeck)
very useful to evaluate a system. There is a lot of instruments going on those which I can evaluate... drums , cymbals,...

And to evaluate the reproduction of voice, I use Anne Bisson Blue Mind. Very well recorded, and known among audiophiles. There is also drums in this, along with some nicely recorded piano.

For ambiance mico details and piano, I use Tord Gustavsen. Good double bass to evluate also. African Magic from Abdullah Ibrahim is a HUGE piano live recording with double bass and drum, I urge you guys to get this one eyes closed and thank me later. :)
About the speakers. Kef makes the Uni-Q driver, and a lot of audiophiles swear by that design in the Blade 2. Coherent point source philosophy.

On the other side, Vivid makes 4 way speakers like the G2 and they swear by that design. More driver philosophy.

Both are opposite designs.... Somebody has got to do something right and the other something wrong...?? They can’t be both right in their approach.....

I sometime feel we are being framed by a lot of speaker makers, the thing is it is very difficult to know the ultimate truth behind the curtain...


Vivid birthday, Vivid birthday
When will we read your reviewey?

Vivid birthday, Vivid birthday
If they re connected surely soon yeah!
Maybe there was a problem with the speakers and he is trying to get a return. Maybe he did not received them yet because delivery was delayed or he wasnt home to accept shipment.

Maybe he took a little vacation week end for his birthday and his wife said no forum typing please for a couple of days.

Maybe something I or someone wrote frustrated him. ( hope not)


I had a feeling there was something about the Vivid WC would not like. Why, I don’t know it was just that they are apart from the sound philosophy speakers he got before those. Hoping we will know more about the reasons they just passed , in the near future...
WC I am myself considering the Sopra 2 to replace my current set of Verity Audio. So I look forward to read you if you get the Sopra 3, and how they compare to the best you’ve heard so far. Are they bright, or a little  thin in the mirange like the older Focals..., etc.
mikepaul , agreed the orange ones really sound the best.

Second best are the white ones. 

;)
WC, if the Vivid G1 are the best speakers you eard except that they don’t fit your room. Why don’t you just get smaller Vivid G3 or G4 ??

I beleive I already know the answer, there are some other things you don’t like about the G1 you do not wish to share on this thread. I understand this, perfectly normal for reasons that are your business only. We, experienced audiogoners, can read between the lines. We well know that someone experienced like you absolutely won’t make the mistake of buying overloading speakers...it is not rocket science...its room size vs speakers size... surely your conections will give you that information before you buy... also dealers are supposed to know that...it is the reason we pay them huge markup... to guide us in selecting  the right 30k or 60k speaker to fit the environment in which it will be playing and getting us satisfaction.
Good idea ysound.

Find you a pair of preowned Q5 at a price you will feel good about. They will work now , and most probably in your future room also. When the room is done, you ll have option to sell or keep depending on your goal of the moment

nebob, I think even if the G2 fits his present room, WC will not want to keep them in his future bigger room...because the G1 would  be the better speaker for that new room.
Is the Sasha 2 really in a higher league than the Sopra 3 ? This is a much interesting question and I can’t wait to read WC comments about it !

Sopra , Kanta, Magico A3, Dynaudio Contour 60, B&W 803d3, Revel 228Be.

These are the ´´new kids on the block’´, and the big question is always...do they really bring new benchmarks for the money compared to the classic top performers out there.
´´To sum it up, on bass, dynamics, presence, stage size Wilson Maxx2 wins. On crystal midrange, resolution, tranparency, high fidelity, focus, Magico S5 mkii wins.´´

Quoted from the net. I think this is spot on what WC will be experiencing.



I think the midrange should be thicker on the Magicos, thiner on the Focals because their very light cone material ( foam sandwich with fiberglass) have always had that sound signature ( supposed to better and richer with the latest designs...Sopra, Kanta, etc.)

I believe the Focals will have more boogie factor , more midrange snap and speed...snare drums twacks should need less power from the amp for the same volume level than the Magico.

I think detail and refinement should be in favor of Magico.

Bass should be more tuneful on the Magico, sealed design + woofer cone material.

I think the Magicos will be easier to set up speakers than Focal. Sealed design, smoother highs...a speaker that behaves better.

The Focal are more extreme...highs...bass...ported design.
WC already knows that shadorne. He just wants to experience it. To know if the Focal or Magico can compete with the G1. To know which  of those two is the best in his room. And we, his followers, are looking forward to read his conclusions.

Why, because most of us don’t  trust reviews of magazines, and most don’t have the connexions or the means to be able to bring all this gear into our rooms to make those tests.

@thezaks `` The one someone sells is never the one to get``.

This statement is true but in an idealistic world, which almost never really applies in everybody `s ( normal guy) audio world.

As I wrote, one s inferior will be someone else superior...so this is why things work out in the audio market cycle.

You are very disciplined. I could not resist trying them. There is so much positive stuff written about Sopras I would like to experience on my system.
Agreed, Sopra 3 are a must try. Because being blown away by the Magicos does not mean you will not be blown away by the Focals even further.