6x5 is technically better, but 5Y3 has more rolling options. |
So, I heard that the L7 will now be in a single giant box, as will the L5 and 6. |
You are most welcome in advance:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ECC40-CV3884-MULLARD-NOS-BOXED-/270762678745?pt=UK_Sound_Vision_Valves_Vacuum_Tubes&hash=item3f0ab699d9 |
He never says what chip he uses. |
The trick in the Lampi Transport is the digi-Lampizator inside. |
SGR, are you in the NYC/NJ area? There is going to be a Lampi rave mid October in NJ and LF himself will be there. You could get to hear them all and judge for yourself.
I believe there will be a L4/L5 and Big 6 there and possibly more cool Lampi stuff. The info is over at Audiocircle. |
And then there is another Lampi wrinkle to consider. Lampizator DSD!!! Tubed purity and DSD make for an explosive combo.
I am checking out first production model (DSD-only) and whoa Mama, DSD128 is akin to master tape on an expensive RTR playback machine.
Beats my Qute which has a Linear PSU option, running DSD64 into the BNC.
Suhweeeeet! Its gonna be hard to part with this baby!!!
Lampi DSD will be a big seller...mark my words. Good think it can be retrofitted into even a single box L4 now. |
SGR,
I think a dual mono L5 chipset in a Big 6 Box with DSD and VC with remote may be the way for you to go. Balanced or SE, depending on if your whole system is already balanced. Duelund caps for sure, but they seem to have a 250hr break-in time, and go thru an M shaped break-in pattern.
You could also specify output tubes to be ECC182 and ask for 5Y3 type rectifier (may cost a bit extra).
Lampi DSD is great, BTW...not sure I can let this one go... |
Glory, the DSD is ready now!!!!
DSD128 is sublime. |
SGR,
I will do an article on this at PTAudiophile soon to sort out the confusion.
1)Correct. Some people prefer the big box rather than 2 separate smaller boxes and other prefer the inverse.
2)Plain vanilla DSD ( what is used as the format on SACDs is DSD64...ie ibit 2.8mhz). DSD128 is double rate DSD, ie double data rate 5.6mhz. Twice the size and a bit better SQ, probably due to the fact that the ultrasonic noise is pushed even further away from the audible frequencies.
3) ECC40 has great SQ, but is less robust that 182. I dont know the characteristics of all, but a buddy just switched from 40 to 182 and prefers the latter. 182 is more robust as well, but also more expensive.
4)I agree here.
5) He uses either 6x5 or 5Y3 rectifier tubes. Both kinds are supplied stock. I think there is more tube rolling possibilities with the 5Y and consequently more upside from tweaking. I have the 6x5 and am happy enough. I did find a few at Ebay to try rolling with. |
SGR, some DSD Dacs can only do DSD64 ...at least for the moment. Chord Qute is an example.
There is a LOT more DSD64 material out there than DSD12, bt there are a few albums out there you can buy online and some people are ripping their vinyl collections to DSD128!!!!!! |
Agear, further to that point. LF has made arrangements that if anything untowards were to happen, all the schematics would be released to the public. Being a point to point wiring hand built item, any competent tech would be able to repair the unit.
Besides, even if he were not around, the company would survive. |
Well Vortrex just posted this at AudioCircle and he seems to be an analog guy like you:
"I got one of the G4 L4 units 2 weeks ago with the Jensen caps, which is still breaking in. It's technically a Level 4.5 as they call it, since it has the Level 5 PCB inside my unit. I'll preface this and say I am not a digital guy. The digital I have heard prior (audio show) has not been my cup of tea. I really like an organic 3D flavor, which digital has not shown me before.
Not having the right pieces to set up this DAC properly, I used the USB cable from my printer and connected it to a Macbook Pro running a trial version of Audirvana Plus. I then got a couple of hi-rez FLAC albums that I am very familiar with on vinyl. I was quite surprised to hear how well this DAC stood up against my vinyl rig (TW Acustic Raven, Ortofon RS-309D, Ortofon Synergy SPU, Leben RS-30EQ, Hashimoto HM7 SUT)! Clearly the DAC was producing a more solid foundation. What I was not expecting is for the digital to have dimension to it. Digital to me always spelled soulless and uninteresting. I won't say it had the depth of the analog rig, but the width was there. Images hover in space. There's a different presentation overall, I would say the DAC is bolder. If you are looking for a way out of analog, this could be your exit point. Looking back to all the previous vinyl rigs I have had in the past, I would choose this DAC over them. I think the analog setup I have now is the tipping point. Maybe the Big Six would close the gap even more or cross it?
I'll also say I was expecting something that was kind of DIY-like. That is not the case at all. It might have a utilitarian look to it, but the DAC is very well built and solid. It's better than some "Made in the USA" gear I have had before. The packaging was also first rate and it arrived only 1 HOUR different from the time Lukasz quoted me at shipment. Great service for sure." |
Mitch2,
Many of these guys have upgraded to L5 and Big6 after hearing the L4! One guy moved to PBD because he wasnted DSD and rips vinyl to DSD128 now. Well last week the Lampi DSD128 was finalized and I have one of the first ones. The same fellow who moved to PBD (who loved the Lampi PCM, even better than the PCM on the PBD) asked me to see if I can get a hold of a PDB-3 and compare them on DSD. It so happens that I may be able to in a few weeks as I know demo room with PBD 3 and 5 and its on our agenda. It is possible to retrofit DSD on a PCM Lampizator Dac now.
I wont tell you what to do, but I suggest you listen for yourself and make up your own mind.
BTW, Vortex said:
I have all the original shipping materials for a safe journey to the new owner. I placed this order right before I unexpectedly bought a house and decided to move cross country. All my time and finances are needed for this new venture.
|
I heard of one guy placing an order for a Big6 one hour after setting up his new L5 and listening to it.
The really instructive thing is that the L4 sell fast second hand. They are very good. |
Mitch, go to Audiogon and find the post detailing the Rave in mid October in NJ.
Even if you cant make it there, post in any of the Lampi threads there asking if there is any owner close to where you live and you would like a demo.
People like Gopher in the NYC area could hook you up. Jriggy is in Indiana and Glory is in Fla. |
I use a SS amp (with superb woofer control due to negative ouput impedance), so have no complaints on that front with my Lampi L4. Perhaps with a tube amp, it may be different, I dunno?
I dont know the L5 personally... |
DSD is via tri-level filtration. No dac chip and no DSP. |
Mitch2, I mean AudioCircle when referring to the Lampi Rave info. |
Wow, good for you SGR! You will love them! I dont have a Transport, but I know its da bomb. I do have a cap modded SBR (with Linear PSU running from my L4, so I can only imagine how much better the Transport is)
Jim is a nice guy. I know him from FBook.
Get the DSD option (and volume control) with the L5, you wont regret it.
PM me over at AudioCircle for more tips if you like
I am wisnon there too. |
Gen 4 uses Current output R2R chips and :
A DISCLAIMER_ THE 6N6P IS NOT SUITABLE FOR LAMPIZATORS WORKING DIRECTLY WITH CURRENT OUTPUT DAC CHIPS LIKE TDA1541A.
For the I-out DAC types allways use 6N2P! |
Weatherb,
DSD and PCM is BOTH played back natively in Lampi Dacs.
DSD will either be an add on option to the normal Lampi Dac (whic is PCM) or you can buy a DSD-ONLY Lampi dac which will NOT play PCM in any shape or form. If you convert PCM music to DSD via computer program (Saracon/JRiver PC, etc), then you can play that back on a Lampi DSD-only Dac.
However, if you have a L5 with the DSD option, it would be best to play back PCM natively via the PCM section of the Dac and DSD, via the DSD section. You can use the remote to toggle inputs to the Volume Control/preamp selector. DSD is filtered and sent as an analog signal to the volume control. |
No, it wont play DSD. It is based on the SqueezeBox receiver and is limited to 24/88.
People who have one say they dont care about HiRez anymore as its sounds so good on RBCD. |
LoL
That is JAMES, not Lukasz who affixes the eye-candy! |
There is DSD and then there is Lampi DSD:
http://parttimeaudiophile.com/2013/09/29/dsd-lampizator/ |
Ask Gopher about the Tungstol.
Try John @ USA Tubes for tube supplies... |
JRiggy,
I just ordered the Tungsol and will be able to tell you my impressions in a week or so. A pal with stock 6x5 rectifier and ECC182 output tubes did tell me this though:
"Bendix 6900(pair) is here. Initial impression is that it sounds absolutely awesome. Fast, but not overly aggressive, top end has more sparkle but not bright, midrange is stunning. I thought it would be cold, but actually it is warmer than the 7119. Soundstage is even more layered and 3D. Great match with the Bendix 5852 recti. No buyers remorse here!"
and
"Last I heard, the Tungsrams were only a subtle but good change over the Phillips/Mullard/Siemens, etc ECC40s. Tungsrams are shorter and probably more robust.
Originally I had the Soviet 6U5C for recti, Sylvania vintage was good - fuller sound, Tung Sol 6x5 built on that with a warmer punch, Bendix 5852 now in which is more linear than all, detailed, transparent, full, but colder than the Tung Sol. With the 6900 in, it compensates now for that lack of warmth in the recti and just sounds great." |
The 6900s are very expensive. I see 4 on EBay with the bid starting at $1K!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-Matched-Quad-Bendix-MU-6900s-the-Holy-Grail-of-Audio-Tubes-/261306304173?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item3cd711c6ad
So no less than $500 a pair! Glory could be right about price to performance ratio.
There is ONE good roll for the ECC40 and its the Tungsram brand! Its shorter, more robust and allegedly has an even clearer midrange! All the other brands of Ecc40s are identical and made by Phillips despite the branding. A Spanish guy has a pair on ebay for about $25 a pair plus shipping. I scooped up the Eastern European ones a day or 2 ago, so be on the llokout for them.
Unlike what Glory says, i think the ECC40s are GREAT sounding, but the Phillips ones are not so robust as they are hit and miss with durability! For the money, they have the best performance and the Tungsram version is the way to go, apparently.
Glory, link me up by email for some scoop! |
The 6900 is uber expensive costing 20x more than a nice Tungsram 40. So yeah, I have no doubts it SHOULD be better! |
Some race feedback from the circle:
rawhit
Jr. Member
Posts: 15
Great gettogether!
« Reply #75 on: Today at 03:35 am »
Quote
This was my first NY/NJ rave and it was a blast.
Major props to Deepak and Chhaya for opening up their beautiful home for us.
I've been to a couple of CAFs and RMAF but nothing beats being able to interact with manufacturers and listen to some awesome gear in a friendly, home like setting. Was fun putting a face to audiocircle monikers.
Lukasz and Merrill are great guys to talk to and build some awesome products.
I finally understand the buzz around Lampi DACs and the GM70 amp. Amazingly natural sounding and just get out of the way of music. Lampi DSD is the real deal, very liquid and gripping presentation.
Oh, and Taras A100 is a killer amp too. Almost tube like in its ability to flesh out the textures.
Listening to all this great gear has given me some serious GAS (gear acquisition syndrome)
Some pics from my camera can be found here http://img.gg/sw9PINT |
http://parttimeaudiophile.com/2013/10/22/lampizator-dsd-dac-first-listen/ |
The Gen 4 has a different architceture and different tubes mate better with it than Gen 3 architecture.
To find out of tubes can be rolled is public info. Do a google search!
6h6p is a smmoth more laid back sound and some people like a more forward hard driving sound. That is the yin/yang of tube rolling, as well as better rendition of different parts of the frequency range. |
ABruce,
I see you are selling your Lampi. What do you replace it with?
Bill,
I too have a modded OR4 but have not used it much. My L4 does NOT have USB, and I have to use converters. I have a Lindemann 24/192 DDC and a iFi ILink with iUSB power and Gemini cable, plus an Ultrafi Aubisque cable. I use the latter mostly with SwissCables digital RCA connector. I need to experiment with the OR4 in January and it will be easier with new equipment stands that allow easier reach behind.
Finally, I exclusively use AIFF, as I am in the Mac world, however, i will convert to Wav and test like what you say. The comparison I have normally seen is Wav vs Flac, not AIFF. |
Bill,
I read this back in 2010 and satyed away from Wav:
"First - we must find a good machine for creating files from silver disks. In my case it is my beloved iMac. It rips CD to AIFF with 9x speed - circa 7 minutes.
Second - we must choose file format. The lossless WAV is no good because Mac OS hates it and because iTunes refuses to attach CD covers to WAV files.
FLAC was rejected because MAC does not support it (yet).
The file which works with Mac, with Windows, with Squeezeboz and with Squeezecenter too is AIFF - a lossless Mac format, a good compromise." |
Bill,
I have similar. I do have the OR4 which I hardly use due to no Integer Mode support. I normally use the iFi Triple play, ie iUSB-Gem cables-iLink and top off with Aubisque filter. I hope to eventually try an iPurifier. My L4 has no USB .only the Lampi DSD does.
2011 stock Mac Mini though with A+ or JRiver. Pangea USB cable and Swisscables digital coax and interconnects. Generic BNC cables for the Chord Qute HD.
I use xACT to convert file formulas.
I will test for myself and see. |
andrew, I love the L7 link you posted before in that other thread.
Its the only online feedback I have seen so far, other than emails:
http://www.review33.com/m/forum_msg.php?db=1&tstart=0&s=&topic=47121019144020&start=20&sort=&number=59 |
Andrew, that is the tubed USB Converter. I thought Gopher was talking about the SqueezeBox based TRANSPORT. |
He spelled out his philosophy on why he used tubes in the www.monoandstereo.com interview.
Check kt out. |
Excerpt from monoandstereo.com interview:
Why tubes in the audio path?
I have no particular attachment to tubes. If the parrot guano gave better results in signal amplification, or transistors - I would use them. Tubes sound good not because they are made of glass, or because they have vacuum inside, but because I can get away with simple amplifier stage without local or global feedback and without high part count. The tube circuit can be as simple as humanly possible - in my case the stage has just one resistor, one triode and one capacitor. Thats why I love tubes. Listening confirms that the signal is pure, uncorrupted, and the musical content comes through, shining in full musical glory.
What would you say, that Lampizator- Lukasz Fikus is doing different and specific to other DACÂs?
Mainly I am very open to listening test and comparisons. I donÂt follow so called datasheet and white paper specs - I use the chips the way I want and I make the chips sound the way I want, even if the approach is far from textbook or dogmatic respect for manufacturerÂs suggestions. I realized that chips for DAC are not digital devices (like in computers) but they are analog devices, responding really strongly to strange manipulations like power supply filtering, capacitor quality, connection topology, clock frequencies, materials used for wiring and soldering, vibrations, magnetic fields, grounding schemes and so on. Making a chip sound in a specific way is like building violins. Yamaha canÂt duplicate what Stradivari did, it is a secret of the trade. It is like cooking, or gardening, or animal training. It is not about zeroes and ones.
Anything special about topology?
There is nothing special really. Anyone can make a circuit equally good just after 2-3 years of every day testing and trying. What is special is my absolutely fanatical approach to testing by ears in thousands of hours of nightime listening. I use circuits insanely simple, if you remove one more part - everything will collapse. So I am testing the absolute limits of simplicity that I can get away with as an engineer. I remove and remove and remove until I canÂt remove anything else and then I make the circuit sound best under these circumstances. In sound quality less is more, because the signal gets less chances to be distorted and loosing the natural beauty of the music.
What does state of the art digital audio and ultra high-end means for you?
As a Âreverse engineer person I want to see the concept behind it, the simple genius design that can be read like an open book, and if it takes a lot of money to realize - it is a no compromise high end to me. Any educated idiot can make a very sophisticated , over-engineered product and pack it with premium parts and market as high end. Only real genius can make it simple, beautiful and sounding right. Very very few engineers can do this. Kondo was the first one, the Pope of high end, and frankly nothing much after Kondo made any progress or breakthrough. To make best amps, best DAC, best cables and best cartridge in one lifetime is a truly buddhist achievement. And he was not an electronic engineer, not even an electrician, just an open, renaissance man with huge passion.
What are your views on balanced topology? Is it a must for best sound in audiophile branded products?
Balanced operation has many many crazy misunderstandings and myths. It is merely a simple way of achieving something, at the cost of something else. It has no correlation with sound quality. It can be compared to 4x4 car design, which achieves good tracking at the cost of price, noise, fuel efficiency, reliability and turning radius. It is a tradeoff like anything else. Having said that, most good gear out there is SE and thatÂs my personal preference. It makes sense for some products like phono stages and DACs but only in the context of really fully balanced rest of the system and at the cost of almost doubled manufacturing cost.
What sets Lampizator audio design above other manufacturers?
It is the end result - the sound at the price. I design my product to be as timeless as possible - a huge engineering and component value that will stand the test of time not in 2 years like modern electronics but in 10, 20 and 30 years from now.
Do you use pure class A in your signal chain and outputs?
Yes, always.
What is your approach to power supply and how important it is in your opinion?
Power supply is everything. Remove the power supply importance and my DAC is like any other 200 dollar DAC from China. Power supply to the tube anodes, tube heaters, and 9 other digital supply points, sets the LampizatOr DAC aside form the crowd and makes it sound as heavenly as it does.
Separated power supply is highly regarded with audiophiles. What are your views on benefits with outboard power solutions and two box design?
I donÂt follow that path because I really know whats going on, I donÂt just speculate that removing PSU from the Âconsumer should Âbring some benefitsÂ. The separation is a huge tradeoff and the result is a proof - closely built supply delivers faster, better and cleaner. There is no mythical Âinterference because I measure it that it isnÂt there. I will take a one box for a two box any time. I sell DAC Level 5 which is a two box only because of lack of physical space in one box. |
Yes Charles,
Lukasz is a great guy. I finally met him in person a month ago and it was a definite thrill. |
From what I heard, several reviewers and audio dealers loved what they heard and had it as one of the top rooms at the Show.
At least 3 review request were made. |
OK, getting REALLY back on topic (talk of other rooms and amps are entertaining, but faaar off topic) can we speak about differences in the L7 to other more known levels?
Is the L7 based on the L5 or L6 circuit? What are the major design differences? I have seen the ga-ga Hong Kong feedback online and in some emails, so this has piqued my curiousity.
Retail for the L7 should be around $10K in the US, no?
What about DHT tube choice, ie 300b, 2A3, or 45 Triodes? There is talk on another forum that the NOS 45s have the advantage of being plentiful and cheap in the marketplace. Is this so? |
Anyone here got to hear the Lampi/Intuitive room on Friday when the FINALLY got all the kinks out and the sound came into its own?
My feedback is the L7 move to the King of the line position and the Dale speakers finally showed their true worth!
I heard L7 is already sold and the level is backordered until Feb at least. Hong Kong and the US are the demand leaders. |
Hopefully Lukasz still makes the SB Transport, as I keep hearing good things about it. My own Duet is modded with better caps and is fed by a dedicated LPSU built into my L4, but the clock upgrade and digilampi section, plus the i2S internal implementation apparently takes it to another level entirely.
Later this year I will likely take the plunge. |
KingHifi.
The buffering would be in the domain of the Squeezplay software engine on the host computer, similar to Audirvana/JRiver and that info is in the public Domain. The SBR is just the streamer/Dac and the Lampizator treatement paradigm is to discard the feeble Dac function and to enhance the digital pass thru by reclocing, improving components and Power supply, as well as to square up the digital wave via the use of the digilampizator.
The TranspOrt is NOT the same as the USB/SPdif converter...there seems to be some confusion here.
Tbg, hello, long time no speak. The speakers were not properly set up and broken in until late Friday, i am told...then it started impressing mightily. Previous skeptics have broken out their checkbooks, I am told. Finally, I have a Lampi DSD-only dac and I can attest to the fact that properly recorded 128 stuff is sublime! |
Kng, You are correct (I was wrong, mea culpa). While there may be local computer "buffer" its not that critical as the signal still has a ways to go to hit the Dac.
After investigations, there IS indeed a Ram buffer located in the SB-R, similar to buffers in DVD players. The buffer is very fast RAM memory and is located an inch or so away from the tube output, so a TRUE buffer, for about 4 seconds (I believe). This is the basic architecture of the SB-R and not unique to the TranspOrt.
The Squeezecentre player may also be storing info on the computer before sending via wireless or LAN cable, but would not be a true buffer, as much can happen to screw up the signal before it gets to the Dac, given the USB cable transmission and the stock SBR processing. |
Gary, I think you know who distributor did a number on you. LoL
The new Box has nothing to do with the amps and is there for production efficiency reasons as well as sonic design reasons. Everything L does is for a purpose and is carefully thought out.
If you ever saw him work you would be amazed.
The amps are selling well BTW, as you would expect from GM70s at this price! |
Wh os tyhe lucky guy that bought the L7 cash from the Show?
Would love to hear feedback from him/her!
The Hong Kong feedback has been gushing so far... |
Not bad news for the 4 at all. The 4 was always sufficient in a single box, based on the parts count.
The L4 is only being ignored for the moment, but it still represents great value, maybe the sweetspot of the range in terms of value. |
Grannyring,
If you buy a modded DVD player from the Lampi shop of just buy the digi-Lampizator kit 100euros and add to say a Denon DVD3910, you get astounding performance. Myself, I have just the Spdif modded Denon (no digi mod) and i disabled all the video sections, etc. Best spinner I have.
I also use a stock Duet with upograded caps and deicated LPSU and that is great.
Point is jitter is only half the story. Power (waveform distortion) is the other.
I think its too much to say low jitter is the end all and be all of good sound. Its important, yes, but not all.
Many ways to skin a cat. |
