Smaller speaker - bigger Woofer?

I've always hated the sound of having the subwoofer dialed in over 60hz. Just gives an ugly bloat in the minds and messes up the sound across the spectrum. When I've had speakers with big bass drivers built in, they did a better job of recreating ambience and even the treble was less harsh and better integrated with a certain kind of ambience detail and integration you can't get with a sub.

One problem with the Vandersteens is the guy who brought them over was demoing with Kimber Cable - yikes. Putting in my speaker cable has obviously really improved the sound, but it's still not what I'm looking for.

I'll check out the Dynaudio. Maybe a smaller version with a sub is as close as I'm going to get.

The problem with 'adding' sub(s) is the crossover. If the monitors go down to say 50hz, and sub(s) range is up to 100hz, or whatever, you are doubling up a 50hz range, leaving a seam in the intetration. Plus the mids of the monitors are still getting low frequency info and continue to strain under it.

With an active XO the mids can cut off at the same frequency subs are engaged for improved integration. Best is probably 100-120hz depending though.

Indicating there is something to be said for aquiring a system that is already designed. Then all that is needed is proper setup for you room.

Anyway, check out the study paper on woofer location: http://www.linkwitzlab.com LINKS link/ 'Subwoofers: Optimum number and location' / 'Getting the Bass Right' link

Both my dble 12" subs http://www.linkwitzlab.com / Phoenix / Woofer, are on the side wall next to the main panels http://www.audioartistry.com / Dvorak, severl feet from the wall behind (and those problematic corners) for that very purpose.

You have to get the right sub with the right speaker and crossover. Understanding what it takes means everything.

Most people are not able for one reason or another to align their subwoofers properly so that the units are time coherent. In your case you surround processor does not have a sophisticated enough processor to manage proper integration. So i don't disagree with what you have experienced but it can be done quite seemlessly. I do it all the time with my own system.

If you like you can order some custom speakers, I emailed you on this matter. You may not have received it. It is not a joke and I am already building a pair for someone else. They are exactly what you are looking for except the trade off in size means a subwoofer is needed to give the last octave a boost in Dynamic Range.

They are a three way with 6" mid and 8" woofers 44"H, 10"w, 14"D they have active crossovers which gives us plenty of Latitude to make them sound anyway you want. All I have to do is send you a corrected file and you upload the new file to the crossover and the edit is made via email. This is not a toy one off I'm offerring you.

Someone is trying to sell something :-)

Check out http://www.linkwitzlab.com for DIY sub, or full range speakers for that matter. Or just knowledge in speaker design... pretty much truth in all things audio.

A great resourse for the novice to become less vulnerable to wanna be's, and think they are's.

I agree the Linkwitz site is a good guideline for two channel systems and dipole bass. It wouldn't hurt to read but at the same time it doesn't address your issue directly.

I have helped with the construction of the Orion and it is a very good speaker. But its more than you mentioned you wanted to spend and somehow (from experience) may require component complexity you won't desire.

And I challenge Didactilly to suggest a speaker that fits your description and fits your price range. Since we know its very easy to vaguely criticize when you don't feel morally obligated to offer a hard solution at the same time.

Yes I am offerring service, because no one has come up with a solution yet and my commercially available ones didn't seem to resonate well.