What Does Holographic Sound Like?


And how do you get there? This is an interesting question. I have finally arrived at a very satisfying level of holography in my system. But it has taken a lot of time, effort and money to get there. I wish there had been a faster, easier and less expensive way to get there. But I never found one.

Can you get to a high level of holography in your system with one pair of interconnects and one pair of speaker wires? I don't believe so. I run cables in series. I never found one pair of interconnects and speaker wires that would achieve what has taken a heck of a lot of wires and "tweaks" to achieve. Let alone all the power cords that I run in series. Although I have found one special cable that has enabled the system to reach a very high level of holography -- HiDiamond -- I still need to run cables in series for the sound to be at its holographic best.

There are many levels of holography. Each level is built incrementally with the addition of one more wire and one more "tweak". I have a lot of wires and "tweaks" in my system. Each cable and each "tweak" has added another level to the holography. Just when I thought things could not get any better -- which has happened many times -- the addition of one more cable or "tweak" enabled the system to reach a higher level yet.

Will one "loom" do the job. I never found that special "loom". To achieve the best effects I have combined cables from Synergistic Research, Bybee, ASI Liveline, Cardas, Supra and HiDiamond -- with "tweaks" too numerous to mention but featuring Bybee products and a variety of other products, many of which have the word "quantum" in their description.

The effort to arrive at this point with my system has been two-fold. Firstly, finding the right cables and "tweaks" for the system. Secondly, finding where to place them in the system for the best effects -- a process of trial and error. A lot of cables and "tweaks" had to be sold off in the process. I put "tweaks" in quotation marks because the best "tweaks" in my system have had as profound effect as the components on the sound. The same for the best of the cables, as well. For me, cables and "tweaks" are components.

Have I finally "arrived"? I have just about arrived at the best level that I can expect within my budget -- there are a couple of items on the way. In any case, I assume there are many levels beyond what my system has arrived at. But since I'll never get there I am sitting back and enjoying the music in the blissful recognition that I don't know what I am missing.

I should mention that there are many elements that are as important as holography for the sound to be satisfying, IMO. They include detail, transparency, coherence, tonality, and dynamics, among others. My system has all of these elements in good measure.

Have you had success with holographic sound in your system? If so, how did you get there?
sabai

Showing 34 responses by csontos

Anybody here heard of the Bedini Analog Vector Spacial Processor? Unlike Carver's effort, this thing maintains a 3D image while while you walk around the room. I've never listened to one. But I just acquired one. They are very rare but I believe Bedini is back into manufacturing and has refurbished ones available and maybe new ones as well. Trademark logo is Bedini B.A.S.E.. They were mainly used in recording studios. The one I have seems to be a second iteration as it looks a little different from the photos I've seen. But I don't know how to hook it up. 3 unlabeled sets of RCAs close together and one unlabeled set on the far right. I've been in contact with Bedini but no response as yet.
Al, he's stating for all intents and purposes, that he's experiencing a far higher degree of holography than you did with your Carver!! I can't believe you're willing to reconcile this to personal individual experience. Reminds me of the seventies when a bunch of brand names attempted to pass themselves off as high end by producing spuriously favorable specs. What's up? Diplomacy does have a down side. Namely public perception.
Why don't you just get rid of your system altogether. Chad probably doesn't have one either, just the cables and tweaks.
Sabai, you are the best example by far, that I have seen on this site so far!
Oh come on, Al. With all due respect, you of all people here should be able to tell us what we can expect to hear and what we cannot regarding the OP's position. Remember the "b.s."? Is it appropriate for all of us to become delusional? Seriously.
Sabai, this whole thread is a joke "book", and you wrote it. But the joke's on you. You're the only one not laughing. Any one who believes the statements you've made is as desperate as you are to legitimize all the money they've wasted on glorified wires rather than concentrating their efforts on gear instead. With the money you've spent, you could've acquired gear that would put what you've got to shame with simple lamp chord!
Tom, but what if you didn't have a panel and just a single line with no breaker? The wire itself is insulated.
The most educated decision you can make if you're reading this thread is to understand and follow Al's responses, however sometimes veiled they may be. He can be far too diplomatic at times imo. But he's been pretty clear here once you've weeded through it. The thing with conditioners is that when you use your power at the optimal time of day, it'll probably sound better without it. Biggest difference I've experienced with that issue is when I installed a dedicated line. I once accidentally plugged my amp into the wrong strip and wondered what was wrong till I noticed it. Very significant difference when I changed it back. That and decent interconnects/speaker cables with large enough awg. is what you need to realize the potential of your gear. The probable non-existent change you'll realize by spending huge money on gimmicky products is far better spent on a nicer piece of gear.
There's also a big difference between artificial effects vs. what's actually going on in the recording studio. Not a lot being said about that here. But there is a lot of hysterics going on considering what is actually achievable with cables.
Try the link to "diminishing returns". I would dare to wager Sabai is burning his crop by now.
There's no mystery here. The territory is well understood, like Saskatchewan. No trees. See right across. Simple. Straight line. As the crow flies. Crystal clear.
Sabai, you're on! With the statements you've made, I don't believe you've been honest with us here. And there have been plenty of allusions to that end. You've been grandstanding here and you know it! I don't think anyone here actually believes you. You seem to be the only one in the whole world who's ever experienced the extent of what you're talking about. Subjectivity is the perfect veil, isn't it. Your problem is that we're all doing the best we can to achieve the closest semblance to reality with our systems; so we're on to you!
Well Sabai, you did in fact respond. Btw, was that a bit of a Freudian slip in your last response to Mapman?
My goodness! You must have been cupping your hands behind your ears. Seems Mapman is way ahead of you.
Since you are dealing with an electro-magnetic field, this may not solve the problem. Have you considered the possibility that the positive effect is being caused and not the negative one? In which case a glass cover (preferably pyrex) would serve you better. You just may have discovered a new tweak! Don't spill the beans.$$
And I thought we were all having fun here. Too bad because I sure am. I'm equally surprised at Sabai. This thread has not imo morphed into anything. We're still actually on the same topic it started with: delusion. I love Jim Carey in Man On The Moon. R.E.M.'s version too. Send in the clowns.
Tom, I've reconsidered my response to your query regarding the cover plate. I probably don't know what I'm talking about here but I'm thinking the 60hz line frequency may be setting up a mechanical amplifier in your panel. You may want to experiment by damping the cover plate with something. Maybe smearing some silicone rubber on the back side of the plate?
To me, the most important aspect as an audiophile is to focus on the objective, measurable, and demonstrable attributes of a system so I sense consensus here but also a little irony.

Yes Geoff, the sun definitely does shine. But is it shiny? Looks like it is.
Seriously. How did the children enter this thread? Did I mention desperation back there somewhere? Get real! Keep talkin.
I happened to have visited that galaxy. I believe it was called the 1970s. It was also discovered that certain other parameters outside of THD were responsible to a large extent for the perceived performance characteristics and attributes of the gear that was considered high end at that time. The cat wasn't in the bag for very long after all the major manufacturers jumped on the bandwagon. Hence the small handful of SS amps on the scene with the levels of THD that was just mentioned. So sorry to burst that little bubble, but tubes didn't and don't have a monopoly on desirable sound characteristics. Not that it was suggested they do, but just in case.
Geoff, I know this sounds crazy and please don't take this the wrong way. But, and I mean this respectfully, is it possible you may have entered the Twilight Zone unawares and it's just ordinary paper that's been transformed into an alien entity that will be rendered harmless once you rent a small plane and fly into a vortex in the Bermuda Triangle? For life of me, I can't think of a better explanation. Hope this helps.
If that's what it is, then I guess I'm stalking everyone. Nothing personal, I'm just having fun.
Okay, If I'm actually beginning to grasp this whole pretense, you guys' definition of holography has not, or only in a limited way, included 3d positioning as it relates to tubes. But simply a sense of three dimensionality around individual instruments. Well I have news for some of you. I enjoy a fairly high degree of pin-point imaging with all my SS amps without this never ending quest to achieve a decent level of realism with external tweaks. The problem is not with the stars my dear, it's in our gear. Bryon seems to be the only one on the right track here. If you want to see a serious change in your system, you have to deal with the internals of your gear. Either by working on what you have, or changing it. You can only imagine what you could have come up with, had you spent all that money on mods by some very brilliant and talented techs and engineers out there. Incidentally, I wonder how many are of like mind as some of you. I think you already have an example or two.