ZYX Universe and Lyra Titan

Richardmr,

I really don't think my comments will help you except to the extent of making you comfortable with whatever you choose. I was one of the attendees Dougdeacon mentions who heard both the UNIverse and Olympos. We had both cartridges mounted on Schroder Reference arms using a Teres 340 twin arm table. We could A/B quite quickly or otherwise with this setup. I think this was about as scientific as you could get but I'm certain there were variables such as how many hours were on the wire in the arms and how many hours each cartridge had previously been used. As Doug said, both were outstanding examples with very little difference between them. In my opinion, for what that's worth. About what you've paid for it, for sure.

I don't even own a cartridge of this calibre myself. Mine is a ZYX Airy 3 S SB which happened to fall at the top of my budget range. While I love my cartridge I doubt the other folks in attendance would have picked the silver wire version I own. I'm not offended at all if that's how they feel. Who knows, they may be right but since, in my system, I have no other reference to compare it to I either made the right choice or I'm lucky enough to not know it. Certainly, if there is a difference I'm confident it is very, very small in the real world of listening. The point I'm trying to make is that since we just don't have any real opportunities for comparrison one needs to be pragmatic. My take? You cannot make a mistake at the level you are considering. Certainly, the arm you are using will make a larger difference (assuming it is one I've not heard wiht a Lyra or ZYX) than the cartridges being considered.

Threads like this serve the purpose of at least allowing you to realize you can't make a mistake. For myself money is an issue. If you can realize significant savings by trading in your old cartridge then I'd suggest you place heavy emphasis on that.

Raul,

You've been outvoted by the six of us. LOL. We still respect your opinion even if it's wrong. Just kidding. You do make a good point about the power of peer pressure but in this case I feel each of us has a fairly strong personality and unafraid of voicing an opinion outside the "supposed" group influence. About the only thing we all really agree on is the strengths of the ZYX lineup. Is a UNIverse the best cartridge made? I honestly don't know but it's certainly in the running. You are very right in that this was a fun time. I wish you could join the group some day since we have so much more in common than we have differences. Best to all, especially Richardmr with whatever cartridge he selects. Let us know, please.

Gmorris,

You do have a way with words.

Gmorris,

I think most of us get careless with the use of words like best sometimes. I can't believe that anyone has enough experience to pronounce what is the best cartridge. There are just too many possible combinations with tonearms. And the cost of doing so! In this case the question was between the Titan and the UNIverse. I was at the four day event that Doug Deacon went to where we compared the UNIverse with the Olympos. Honestly, this was just about the most scientific comparrison one could set up. The Olympos is a much more expensive cartridge than the Titan (might not mean much) but since we came so close to comparing the two cartridges aked about I find it fair to offer up our take on them. Ever since the first discussion about our findings were posted here we have been attacked pretty agressively. We weren't scientific enough, responded to peer pressure, and on and on. It's tiresome to see myself or someone I know well being attacked unfairly. You're welcome to send me an email for my phone number and call me if you want the details but I just don't feel up to typing that much. I can also give you some insight into how much I think Frank Schroder knows about these things. He's a very humble and pleasant person with an incredible sense of humor, knowledgable about many things. I'm 55 and have been into analog since the 60's. I certainly don't consider myself and expert on much but I have a very good set of ears with about as much live seat time as anyone. I consider myself to be quite bright too. Being around Frank and a group of other vinylheads for a casual dinner is a jaw dropping experience. Being with him for an entire, extra-long weekend was an honor. He probably wouldn't agree with that assessment but I was really humbled in so many ways. Certainly, he knows enough to make "arguably" one of the best pivot tonearms on the planet. If we can't offer up opinions asked of us then what is the point in posting? Some of the things said freely here, sitting behind a keyboard in total anonymity, would not be said to my face. Well, nowadays you could get away with it but you get my drift. Sorry for allowing my buttons to get pushed.

Raul,

Back at you. You seem to totally ignore the fact that I've never said the ZYX UNIverse, or for that matter, the ZYX line is the best. Never. Hell, I would be foolish to post such a remark because I simply haven't heard all of the offerings. I've said repeatedly that tonearms and cartridges need to be evaluated together. I have explained to the best of my ability the strengths of the ZYX cartridges I am familiar with. I voted with my pocketbook what cartridge I felt was the best for me and my system.

Again, the poster asked for anyone that had experience with a UNIverse and a Titan to share which they thought was better. Unlike most people I have heard a comparison of something close to what he was asking; a comparison of a UNIverse and a Olympos. I gave my impressions. What the Hell is wrong with answering the man's question? I even said I would place heavy emphasis on the ultimate difference in cost because he had a Helicon to trade in.

You've made personal and ugly attacks on several of us for how we conducted our evaluations. Recently, I grew tired enough with your abrasive style to turn the questions around and ask them of you. You didn't respond. It's obvious this boils down to you wanting your opinion to be the only one considered. Sorry but that's not going to fly.

Further, I was more irritated with what I viewed as an unwarranted attack on Frank Schroder. That is what my criticism of Gmorris was about. I stated my objection, apologized for getting angry and he even offered up that his wife thinks he's kind of over the top in getting irritated by folks using the word best too loosely. I agree with him 100%. You have assigned guilt to me where it is undeserved. I await an apology for your remarks on this thread and some answers to questions asked of you on the other thread.

Perhaps you would be better served by having a little fun with audio as you accused us of doing. You sure suck all the fun out of trying to help a guy here with some insight that was very close to the question asked.

76doublebass, I agree with what you heard 100%. I also heard my identical Airy 3 in another room and it too sounded really, really bad. So bad, that I told the exhibitor that they would be better served by not playing analog at all.