Best solid state pre-amp below US $ 10.000,00 ??

grant you may be correct, but also realize that the Audio Aero does have a built in anal;og outpput stage, which if you are using ity ve a stand alone preamp, it clearly inferior. basically it boils down to whether the built in preamp section of that particular CDp is comparable to allowing it to run at a 'fixed' volume and allowing a real outbpard preamp do the honor of preamping and volume controlling. So it's not really as simple as preamp vs no preamp....

moreover, many have remarked that the Audio aero built in preamp pretty much stinks outside of -9db to -6dB (referring to its volume display when used as a preamp).

OK, so your opinion is that the analog output stage of the AA is responsible for its lack of detail when running direct? And, this output stage can be bypassed when using a separate preamp? This would explain why one might hear more detail with an outboard pre, but it doesn't say much for the AA's capability to run direct, especially given the additional cost.

Guidocorona -

For what it's worth, I own a VAC Renaissance Mark One, purchased directly from Kevin Hayes of VAC. Also, I just spoke with Brent @ VAC to reconfirm what Kevin told me at the time I bought mine.

There is NO - as in Zero - tangible sonic differences between the two versions of this model - only cosmetic and convenience features, such as the ability to activate the Cinema ByPass via the remote, a different volume control, a more simple front panel, a 12-v trigger and more indicator LED's. The sonic characteristics, audio circuitry & design itself are virtually identical.

However, if you are referring to the $13k, 2-chassis Renaissance SIGNATURE Mark 1 & 2 models, then yes, they are very different animals compared to the 'standard' Ren and to each other. In fact, the Sig 1 definitely has a limited range of amps that it will work well with, due to its extremely high output gain (something like 33db).

Kevin even advised that I NOT buy a Sig 1 since I intended to use it with the hi-gain Pass X-series amp that I had at the time - it would not mate well with it. The Sig 2 is indeed a pared-down Phi preamp that works with a far greater range of amps, due to the totally different & unique circuit design, but it was out of my price range.

As for build quality, maybe Frank saw a Standard Pre instead of a Ren?? They have very different construction, at least in the visible fit n' finish compared to the Ren models. I have some pics of my Ren (including the internals) that I would be happy to email if you question the construction, which I found to be FAR above average IMHO.

My Ren Mark I, which superceded a Placette Active Linestage, Pass X2.5 and a PSE HL-1 Hybrid Tube Linestage, has shown NO softness that I can identify. In fact, it proved to be MORE dynamic then even the solid-state Pass X2.5, while providing that 'tube magic' thing that makes it all worthwhile.

Having said all this, I agree that the Retail price of both the Ren and Ren Sig are way-high. But, at their current used prices, they are terrific value.

Grant - EXACTLY. Unforunately the analog output stage of the AA can not be bypassed completely (the way it can be on a Levinson 390S - I used to have one of these too), but when running a preamp, they (AA) advise its best to set the volume to "-7dB", and to my ear (as well as many others I corresponded with), it breaks down * SOME * once you get away from that setting.

The fact that the built-in preamp in the AA does not compare to several preamps retailing for $10K does not mean it's a failure, really - its a matter of degree. I guess it's not fair expect the built in preamp on that unit to compete with the very best stand alone preamps. FWIW, i also thought my Levinson 390S sounded best with a "high quality" (in my case a $8700 Ayre K-1x) preamp than direct.

I've never hraed it, but it sounds like the EMM preamp is very good, so it might sound better without a preamp - but see here - where some thought it did sound better with an excellent preamp.

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1119833619