Believers VS. nonbelievers???? GEEzzzzz

if, indeed, there are strongly-held polar opinions of a product that may be expressed in a manner adherents of either end of the spectrum can understand, then that product is on the cusp of subjectivity. its being useful or harmful, worthy or scornful, valuable or worthless becomes, then, a matter of faith. wars have been fought over such beliefs. is it any wonder that something warlike occurs when our subjective views of beloved audio gear, tweaks, and very auditory accuity are challenged? i don't like it when this happens any more than elizabeth or others who have joined this thread. i also abhor my own failings that allow me to get sucked into these battles sometimes. none of us can change human nature, tho, which is why i think audiogon has attempted in a still flawed way to impose upon us a set of standards that reel in our tendancies to behave like savages. sadly, there will forever be jerks like 720... trying to entice us into stone throwing, no matter how many rules or rating systems are put in place. the best we can do is ignore them, as others have already said. the worst we can do is allow these interlopers to drive us away. this is a wierd and wonderful cyberspace village that is constantly being recreated. just remember that every village needs an idiot or two.

I completely agree. I know I've heard of many gadgets that seem like complete quack science to me, and many might be, but I thought the same thing about interconnects, the Quantum Symphony Pro, and power cords until I tried them.

Wow, congradulations to Sugarbrie, Estrnad, Dekay, Craig, Gallaine, Albert, Kelly and Phild. these are some very well thought out posts, maybe the best I've seen, Thank-you. And thank-you Elizabeth for the forum! J.D. (you each get +2,+2)

Well, speaking as a skeptic, I'd like to say that the lot of you are full of...oh, wait, that's not what you wanted to hear. Actually, I find Audiogon's discussions far more civil than those of, say, rec.audio.opinion. Indeed the most intemperate responses I have seen came from believers who took umbrage at someone daring to suggest that the laws of science ought to be presumed to govern audio. I don't care if you choose to believe something that lacks any scientific basis. What I do care about is the peddling of pseudoscience to justify that choice. It's a gross disservice to the less knowledgeable lurkers who are trying to learn something here.

There are plenty of things in this world that work despite lacking a clear or testable scientific explanation. Trial and error sometimes is the most sound process available to us. But, basing a choice or argument on pseudoscience is another matter. I agree that it's a gross disservice, or just plain gross. I've read some terrible and even self-contradictory explanations of how certain accessories work, but I'm not sure that has much correlation with whether the product works or not. It's marketing dressed up as (pseudo)science, and I agree we'd be better off without it. We had an interesting pseudo-science attack over on the power cord thread, where a doubter claimed to be championing an ultra-rational position but displayed such a lack of understanding of scientific method and logic that it quickly became comical. It just shows that "true believers" are not confined to the tweakers. Or, in other words, there are "true-non-believers" as well as "true believers," and both are guilty of short-shrifting the importance of real world evidence. "True-non-believing" has the advantage of being cheaper, however.