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Dream speakers and amp for an 11x14 room?

Hi All,

I'm a first-time poster and hate to present an idiosyncratic problem, but I'm getting the impression that the devil is in the details when it comes to high-end audio, so here goes:

I've got an 11x14 living room that serves as a home theater, and currently have a great video projector that I'd like to mate with a top-notch two-channel set up (I've been persuaded to give up on the 5.1 surround idea). My dream is to have a system that's capable of everything - from running quick, delicate, joyful circles around Beethoven's middle quartets to disgorging "Led Zeppelin I" with a massive, terrifying soundstage.

I was initially hell-bent on floorstanding speakers - I've never shopped high-end audio until now, and remember the big floorstanders my father had back in the 80s, with 12-inch woofers powered by a big, late-70s solid-state Scott amp. The Gallo 3.1 were one idea, as well as the FJ (Blumenohofer) Oms. Both of those models attracted me partly because of their wide soundstage and sweet spot (the latter unfortunately lacking in a few other models that have attracted my interest, including the Devore 8s and 9s).

But while I've been impressed during a few recent auditions by the floorstanders, and hate the tiny little images thrown by most bookshelves, the more I read the more it seems that such bigger speakers may be a bad idea for the room in question - I don't have room to be placing speakers three feet away from the wall - two is even a stretch.

A couple of other key constraints: The speakers basically have to fit under the 6 1/2-foot-wide movie screen, whose bottom edge hangs 38 inches from the floor. That's because the screen pulls down alongside the left side of this "front" wall, while immediately to the right of the screen a bedroom door is cut into the wall.

It should be noted that this front wall is of a cheap, hollow construction - courtesy of an enterprising landlord who moved to convert my apartment into a two-bedroom - and I worry that will be a factor when it comes to bass. There's also another bedroom door - immediately to the right of and at a right angle to the first, so as to form a kind of 90-degree void to the right of where the right speaker would be placed.

Opposite this front wall, 14 feet away, is a double-door that opens into a kitchen that's about 10x11. Through all of this, the ceiling height is about 7 1/2 feet and the floors are hardwoods with a few oriental rugs available if necessary.

Now, as a stopgap, I've installed a cheap 5.1 surround system, with a right bookshelf and a center speaker under the movie screen, and a left bookshelf speaker sitting - yes, that's right - in the back corner of a bookshelf that's built into the left wall. This latter speaker seems to have trouble generating a lot of sound, given the few precious inches of space behind it. I've also got a powered subwoofer on the floor under the movie screen.

So given all that data, I guess the first key question is - are there bookshelf speakers, a center and a woofer that could take the places of the cheap ones and sing, despite the lack of space behind them? I really wouldn't want to place them, or any corresponding subwoofer, more than 6 inches to a foot away from the wall (or a few inches from the back corner of the bookshelf, in the case of the left side).

And the second question would be - provided I'm willing to move the easy chair that's in the left corner under the movie screen - is there a pair of floorstanders, preferably less than 36 inches high, much less 38, that could deliver what I'm looking for in terms of sound, given the fact that they'd basically need to be as close as 4 feet together, with one about two feet from the left side wall and the other with a couple of doorways off to its right and back right?

For those of you who have gotten this far and still have a clue as to what I'm getting at, I am both grateful and impressed. Please let me know what information I can provide to clarify the situation. I'm looking to pay up to $3000 or so for a used pair of speakers, probably the same for a used amp. Interested in everything from solid-state to SETs - but seems like I should concentrate on this speaker question first.

Thanks!
coverto
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mapman
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"Mapman - what you're saying makes me think it'd be great to audition a pair of these before buying, but is that possible?"

You pay up front, audition in your home for several months (the only reliable way) and then can return for money back if not satisfied.
coverto OP
44 posts
 
On the subject of the omni-directional sound - I did get a chance last week to audition some Gallo 3.1s, and it seemed to me that the sound of guitars and drums and such was very "up close" but nevertheless there was stereo imaging - guitar on one side, drums on the other, that kind of thing. So it wasn't necessarily a case of a singer's mouth being 10 feet wide, as one poster in another forum described it, but those drums and guitars and vocalists did seem pleasantly, satisfyingly big from where I was sitting. Without trying to lead the witness too much, is that the kind of thing I could expect from the Ohms?

Moreover - is there a witness out there who has heared both the Ohm MWTs and the Gallo 3.1s who could give a more detailed comparison?
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mapman
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I auditioned Gallo 3.1 refs and liked them but preferred both OHMs and Quad ESL. The OHMs are a fraction of the cost of QUAD ESLs I preferred.

The Gallos and OHMs have some similarities but the OHMs are smoother and more balanced top to bottom. Gallo REf 3.1 are more of a wide dispersion design (sound dispersed widely) but not omni directional (sound dispersed evenly in all directions. OHMs are pseudo omni in that the super tweeter is directional and the OHM omni Walsh driver's level is physically attenuated by damping material inside the cage in the wall facing directions to enable placement closer to walls (both back and side).

Micro Walshes will also cost about $1000 less than a pair of Gallo Refs new I believe.

The Gallos would probably work better than MWTs in rooms larger than yours. Larger and more costly OHMs would be needed there.
coverto OP
44 posts
 
So, given that the Gallo 3.1s are more wide than omni directional like the OHM, is the image thrown by the OHM indeed larger than the Gallo 3.1 - the proverbial 10-foot-wide singer's mouth? When I auditioned the Gallos, I was sitting about eight feet back and the speakers were probably 8 feet apart. In retrospect, it was a slightly odd experience of being far away yet extremely close - in other words a large, localized image - a big guitar, maybe 10 feet long, being plucked in the vicinity of the right speaker, and a big snare drum, maybe two or three feet across, being brushed in the vicinity of the left speaker. Does that coincide with your recollection of the Gallos, and how would it compare with the imaging of the Ohms?
mapman's avatar
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mapman
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"a large, localized image - a big guitar, maybe 10 feet long, being plucked in the vicinity of the right speaker, and a big snare drum, maybe two or three feet across, being brushed in the vicinity of the left speaker. Does that coincide with your recollection of the Gallos, and how would it compare with the imaging of the Ohms?"

With good gear the OHM soundstage will generally extend from wall to wall and from speaker to ceiling vertically and may also have depth extending beyond the rear wall, depending on room, setup and listening position. Comparing a large soundstage to a small one is like comparing a detailed big screen TV to a detailed small screen TV. Some might prefer the smaller screen because the same picture appears sharper. Some will like the large screen because the image is still sharp but they can also make out more details because things are bigger and there is more space separating features of interest.

The perceived size and location of things will vary from recording to recording depending on how the piece was miked and produced. The OHMs will essentially just reproduce in your room what the producers capture in their recording and production process, which is really the best any system can do.

Accordingly, if you heard a "10 foot guitar", that may be due to very close miking during the recording process, kinda like the audio equivalent of a close zoom of the player doing his thing on a music video.
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