LONDON Decca, Tzar DST and similar cartridges


I have always been curious about these phono cartridges and the Stereophile review of the Tzar DST has heightened my interest. When I read about the peculiarities of these cartridges, I am put off from trying them. Can anyone offer persuasive reasons to try them and also provide real practical advice on how to make them work reliably?  Tonearm suggestions? Phono preamp suggestions? Damping recommendations? How badly do they grind out record grooves?  Any other words of advice? Thanks. 
128x128kmccarty
However, no matter how good the Decca is, it doesn't beat a 15 IPS master tape - no way.
I have several cartridges (out of the 70+ I have owned) that are closer to the sound of master tapes than the Decca London Reference. The high-frequency performance of the DLR is certainly not as vivid, crystalline or shimmering as many of my top MM and LOMC cartridges and as mentioned earlier, the width of the sound-stage is disappointingly narrow.
The charm of the DLR is in its sheer 'bravado' and unabashed delight in its presentation of 'SOUND'.
For those used to the inhibited and precisely self-conscious nature of most LOMCs....this can come as somewhat of a revelation. However, for those with an appreciation for the finer vintage MMs, the Decca London sound is merely a confirmation of what true vinyl reproduction can achieve.

Good points, halcro. True, the Decca/London does not have the delicacy in high frequencies of a great moving coil. As with every link in one's Hi-Fi chain, priorities must be chosen, as no one product is better than all others in every way. For me, the main failing in reproduced music is in it's sounding "canned"---a pale, lifeless, soft, thin, diffused, anemic copy of a colorful, vivid, energetic, explosive, full-bodied, whole, original. The Decca/London, for all it's faults, just makes the sound of the instruments and voices contained in the grooves of an LP sound more like their real-life selves than does any other cartridge I've heard. And, perhaps more importantly, the manner in which those instruments are being played and those lyrics being sung. The D/L is a very "physical" transducer, the force with which the bow of a cello or double bass is pulled across the instruments strings being heard and felt (Yo Yo Ma attacks his cello, non unlike how Keith Moon did his drumkit!). How hard a drummer is smacking a drumhead with his sticks can be felt (important to me---I'm a drummer), but so too can the faint sound of ghost notes be heard. The D/L does percussion better than any other cartridge I've heard, with an unequalled dynamic capability. The sound of a guitarists plectrum (pick) hitting the strings---very visceral. Then there is that "in the room, right in front of you" characteristic of the D/L sound, something I crave. Some attribute the D/L's "speed" as the reason for it's excellence in all these regards. Others, it's lack of cantilever "haze", etc. All I know is that instruments and voices sound more whole, fleshed-out with more body (it's as if all the frequencies making up the sound and timbre of an instrument or voice reach the ear at the same time, as in a time-aligned loudspeaker), and transients have more "snap". Hope this doesn't come off as sounding gratuitous or over-the-top!

kmccarty---I've been thinking it over, and here's what I suggest: The $5200 price of the Reference is an awful lot to gamble on a sound you have yet to hear. Some have tried a London, and found it to be too "relentless" or brash (who knows if that was a result of the tone arm used not being up to the task, or the proper 15k/220pF loading not being employed), as may you. Even the $3000 of the Jubilee is a lot to gamble on. I think trying the $1200 Super Gold is a good idea; if you like it enough, you could then move up to the Jubilee or Reference if you want. Don't forget to specify the Decapod! By the way, there is a virtual system (Small Attic Retreat) featured in the Audiogon weekly recap that contains a London Gold or Super Gold (they look identical) fitted with the Decapod. The owners name is jtnicolosi, and he has the London on one of his three tables, a Garrard 301 with a 12" arm (the Schick?).

ct0517---We are going to end up with very similar systems, aren't we? I had forgotten about the $12,000 straight tracking London arm. I've never heard from an owner of one, or seen a review. I couldn't use it on my Rock anyway, or afford it!

topoxforddoc---I have a R2R (Revox A-77 Mk.3), but it's a quarter inch/ quarter track. Have some pre-recorded 7" reels (RCA, Mercury), and those I made myself with a pair of omni condenser mics. But I still need my London cartridges (as well as table and arm), 'cause I can't get the Revox to play my LP's ;-).   

Hope this doesn't come off as sounding gratuitous or over-the-top!

It might if one hadn't actually heard the DLR....😎
Kmccarty
Ct0517, I can’t use my stereo system on the first without disrupting family life. I agree that would be better for turntables.


yes, better for turntables, but also for large speakers with dynamic cone drivers that send excess vibrations downward.

Regarding Warren, I am not sure what his issues with my system are. Perhaps he isn’t familiar with my turntables.

Kmccarty
Regarding the Decca folks/representatives discussed on this thread. I will say I have come across individuals in this business, and I am not saying that those mentioned here are like these folks. After all I don’t personally know them. The folks I am thinking about have been down their road, experiences, and have their own take on things. If certain criteria are not met; the answer will always be no, not good enough unless all the t’s are crossed and the i ’s dotted. The t’s and i’s here, as this is vinyl (a mechanical, vibration, resonance process) could very well come down to the Room Type/Location, and the type of tonearm. I say this from the limited information on this thread. Dealing with vibrations that get amplified from a very small signal are real. In the end, imo, these folks are as passionate as anyone else, and are just trying to make sure "you", meaning whoever they are talking to, get to their "place" and "experience" what they experience. Some are better at dealing with people than others when it comes to this.

True Story
I went to hear and maybe buy a 200 lb amplifier. I arrived at this person’s house who lived alone in a large two storey home with full 8 foot ceiling basement. After greeting me, instead of going down or across the main floor we headed up the stairs to my surprise. In the large master bedroom was contained high end audio gear including very large dynamic cone speakers that were sitting on concrete blocks. Long story short, this fellow was only digital but he was considering vinyl. I told him with his gear to strongly consider moving everything to a dedicated space in the basement. The first floor was also suspended wood beams, typical of Ontario Canada housing. He told me he couldn’t do this. His basement which he showed me before I left (with the amp) was full of racks containing electronic diagnostic gear, and vintage electronics pieces. He was an Electronics Engineer with the local Honda Automobile Plant. He worked with the actual electronic circuits.
Just sayin...

Cheers Chris

I have read a lot of what has been written here, the Tsar as mounted up on my massive gimbaled 3D arm on the Avenger Direct Drive is as good if not better than the Atlas and the Ortofon A95, which means it is as good as it gets with even more life than either of them.


You could pick some items from all three that you love the most but overall the Tsar is state of the art in phono.  I have an Ampex ATR-102 running 1/2 track masters and this is as good as it gets on vinyl.  If you have a disc with the hole in the center, a massive yet damped arm, the system warmed up, and your speakers broken, in this combo will put Gary Karr and his 400 year old contra-bass in the room.  I am stunned!!!

As close to master tape as I have ever heard.


HW