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Any comments on DAC going direct to power amplifier or to pre-ampliifer?

My local retailer HIGHLY RECOMMENDS the use of a pre-amplifier.  Bricasti believes that going direct to a power amplifier sounds better.  And, I also know that everyone had a "different opinion" about going direct or using a pre-amplifier.  

I am running my Bricast1 M1 SE DAC direct to my Hypex NCore NC400 Bridged Mono Block class D power amplifiers (no pre-amplifier) and like the sound quality very much.   

For me, the sound is more natural and clearer by going direct to a power amplifier. Of course, I think the M1 SE DAC has special “custom" circuits in the analog section to make it sound so good. I returned home and listened to my system.  It sounds terrific and I continue to enjoy and recommend the Bricasti M1 SE DAC.

Please note that we removed the R141 (circuit) from my Hypex NCore NC400 bridged mono blocks, thus lowering amplifier gain by 14 dB, requiring 14 dB higher M1 volume setting for same playback level.  Bricasti says the goal is to have the M1 CLOSE to 0db front panel attenuation.  If you reduce the volume on the M1 SE DAC, you cause more bit reduction meaning you lose sound quality.   We discussed this modification with Hypex and they approved the removal of the R141 circuit.  They suggested we be very careful removing the 4 R141 chips (for my 4 NC400 amplifiers) to avoid board damage.  

I noticed that many of the newer DAC’s (even the new Ayre QX-5 Twenty DAC and many others) have volume controls meaning their DAC/Pre-amplifiers are designed to go direct to a power amplifier (as an option, of course).  

What are your experiences of going direct to a power amplifier or using a pre-amplifier?  Have you compared going direct vs. going to a pre-amplfier and noticed any sound quality differences?  Have you gotten different results from using different DAC's and amplifiers?   Your comments are appreciated.  Thanks.





hgeifman
kalali's avatar
kalali
1,645 posts
 

"Better off finding/changing the "fatiguing" component."

Absolutely agree. I know full well in my set-up, my mediocre DAC is causing the fatigue/digititus. Folks with high(er) quality DACs probably have better experience using the direct connection method. That is of course if the components match and they provide the proper gain to meet the needs of the listener.

meerzistar
232 posts
 
DACs can absolutely add brightness/ listener fatigue, just like other components can. If they all did what the name implies that would make it too easy ;)  
georgehifi's avatar
georgehifi
4,966 posts
 
DACs can absolutely add brightness/ listener fatigue
I put this to those that have this problem.
If your dac does this, then isn’t it worth looking for a new one that doesn’t?
Not by slipping in an expensive piece of equipment to hide/colour that sound with even more gain that you don't need, and at the same time rob the transparency/dynamics. As isn’t that’s a step sideways if not backwards?.

Cheers George
cerrot's avatar
cerrot
1,606 posts
 
I had my dac direct to amps for over a year and thought it sounded awesome - clear, dynamic.  I added an inexpensive preamp (ayre k5xemp) and really liked what I heard (more emotion...).  I went for a used Jeff Rowland Criterion preamp (battery powered, $18 grand new, picked it up for half that) and COULD NOT believe the improvement.  A preamp is the heart of your system.  
guidocorona
4,114 posts
 

Hello Cerrot!


My own experience points to DAC+pre vs DAC alone is a question which can have multiple valid answers.... I also used the Rowland Criterion, fed by the Rowland Aeris DAC. Amps were, and still are, the Rowland M925 monoblocks.


I must say that I like both presentations:


Criterion+Aeris yielded a subtly warmer and intimate presentation, versus Aeris by itself being slightly more revealing and linear.


Ultimately, what made me decide to withdraw Criterion from the chain was a simple matter of economics: As I have a single source -- my Esoteric X-01 used as a transport -- I could no longer justify the presence of Criterion.


This does not mean however that I will be pre-less forever....


I have heard that the new Rowland Power Storage Unit which can replace the power supplies of Aeris and of Corus adds so much to the system that one of these days I might very well add the Rowland Corus pre, and feed both Aeris and Corus with the PSU ultra-caps based power supply.....


Oops... I forgot that I am married.... The wifie will likely shoot down any of my pindaric dreams of audiophilic grandeur *Sighs!*

  




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